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I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

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Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Muting the first string is natural, trying not to mute it and fret it correctly is what makes it hard to play. It's vastly easier to just play the triad on the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th strings with the first 3 fingers; forget the bar. And if it sounds weak, turn up the volume or strum harder. :)

Yeah, turning up the volume or strumming harder isn't exactly going to fill out that frequency spectrum.

Perhaps you missed the smiley. In any case, you can drop the low root and add the high one and it still only takes 3 fingers. I generally leave out the high note and play the middle triad and the bass with the thumb Hendrix style as it feels the most comfortable.

But your main point was that the F was the most difficult to play, when what you really mean is your favorite 4 note version of the F is more difficult to play. A simple F triad, or even the triad with the bass is trivial to play, certainly no harder than any other first position chord except perhaps Em.

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#162
post #134
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A simpler explanation is simply the changing market and distribution. It was really only in the last two hundred years that composers could support themselves by selling their music rather than relying on patronage, with Beethoven being the first to do so. Cheap recordings and broadcasting have changed the game entirely. You might not be able to name a single popular singer of the 19th century, but that's not because…

Agree with your thesis, but John Williams is the wrong guy for your point. He's a popular composer too, in his own way. You could point to the Neo-Classicists -- although Prokofiev's dead, of course. Or there's Penderecki; perhaps a hard sell, but deserving.

Definitely. But a major trend in art music relatively recently has been the mix of foreign and other forms with Western styles (and certainly true of the music I'm familiar with). I could hardly call Karl Jenkins or Tan Dun musical descendants of Beethoven. Perhaps I picked a name based on the wrong criteria.

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#163
This was an interesting article, but it's really sad to see that the comments here have devolved into the predictable "all pop music is garbage because they only use 4 chords" argument. It's exactly the same thing as someone looking at a Jackson Pollock and determining that it's garbage because "how much talent does it take to throw a bucket of paint on a canvas?".

The point of music, or any art, is to evoke an emotive response from the audience. To equate the "quality" of art to the technical abilities of its creator is essentially to reduce it to something more akin to juggling knives or spinning plates. Art isn't about virtuosity, it's about emotion.

But hey, if that's your thing, there are a ton of Dream Theater records available on iTunes.

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#165

What I'd like to see is a plot of the number of chords used in a song versus time. Possibly even broken down by genre, or correlated to other qualities (sex of singer) et cetera. If you start at the 1950s, you'll see very simple rock songs; your classic three-chord rock songs. As you hit the 1960s you'll see more complexity; The Beatles, for instance, had more harmonic complexity than what had come before, which cont…

Well, you'd have to go by the top n most popular songs for a given year, because otherwise you'll see an explosion over time since there were simply more albums recorded in 1980 than 1950, or in 2010 than in 1980. 2010 had a lot of shitty simplistic pop songs, but it probably had more prog-metal releases as well. Actually, if you go by all releases, pop music might have a diminishing impact, since it lacks a thriving independent scene.

Incidentally, the Beatles' influence is overstated--they usually popularized the innovations of others rather than innovating themselves. They were influential by virtue of their popularity, but they weren't as original. Pierro Scaruffi overstates his point perhaps, but has written the quintessential polemic against the myth of the Beatles: http://www.scaruffi.com/vol1/beatles.html

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#166
post #140

What I'd like to see is a plot of the number of chords used in a song versus time. Possibly even broken down by genre, or correlated to other qualities (sex of singer) et cetera. If you start at the 1950s, you'll see very simple rock songs; your classic three-chord rock songs. As you hit the 1960s you'll see more complexity; The Beatles, for instance, had more harmonic complexity than what had come before, which cont…

Your analysis is overly dismissive of genres that you presumably don't like. Simplistic pop songs aren't a new phenomenon; they were just as present in the 60s as they are now. We just don't listen to them anymore as they haven't stood the test of time. This was abundantly evident last weekend when I went through a stack of about 100 45s from the 60s and early 70s that I inherited. (My father was a radio DJ during th…

We just don't listen to them anymore as they haven't stood the test of time. This was abundantly evident last weekend when I went through a stack of about 100 45s from the 60s and early 70s [...] I'd never heard of 90% of the bands

There was a Cambrian explosion of music in that period, and virtually no one ever heard of 90%, probably 99%, of the bands. Countless groups sprang up all over the place and pressed records for their local markets. People have devoted careers to tracking down the recordings of that period; one of them, Greg Shaw (whom I knew for a while) had over a million records. He put out a series of influential compilation albums of his favorites that spawned an entire genre (garage rock). Decades later, this stuff is still being unearthed and released. There are entire series of albums devoted to the 1960s proto-punk of Oregon, or Denmark, or Uruguay. It's just amazing how much there is (enough that I'm skeptical of claims that more was recorded in the 80s), and much of it -- tastes vary, of course -- remains amazingly alive and good. A lot of people would disagree that it hasn't stood the test of time; every generation produces new acts in this lineage (e.g. Black Keys), and the underground history of the music continues to be handed down through the fanbase. Its popularity ebbs and flows in a 10-year cycle or so. Right now it's on an upswing.

Edit (by way of response to the rest of this thread, not to your comment): it's foolish to identify complexity with good music. Punk/new wave was a reaction against complicated, highly produced music which used an awful lot of chords. The entire career of bands like the Stooges and the Ramones was a self-conscious mining of the opposite aesthetic. Consider the famous 2-note guitar solo in the Buzzcocks' "Boredom": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoYiQ8Qsozk&t=1m19s. The rest of the band was rolling on the studio floor laughing while the guitarist played it because nobody believed it was possible to do a guitar solo like that, let alone for that long. It's as far from complicated as you can get but still a great creation. Or think of John Cale's one-note piano drone that runs through the Stooges' "I Wanna Be Your Dog": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gsWt7ey6bo#t=23. Cale came from La Monte Young and the Fluxus movement -- highly self-aware avant garde early 60s stuff that he put into a deliberately primitive incarnation. Not saying everyone should like it, but it's as influential and artistic as anything of the last 40 years.

The only rule is that you can't predict what form great art will take. The minute somebody thinks they've figured it out (number of chords? please), the muses jump and bless the opposite.

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#167
On a related note (corniest pun of the day), the Australian musical comedy act Axis of Awesome made a song called Four Chords Song, which is basically a 47-song medley all using the same chord progression.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Axis_of_Awesome#Four_Chords...

They've said that the chords are used by some of the most well known songs in the world, and their performance demonstrates this nicely, as in this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOlDewpCfZQ

The above link is the official video; but they explain their reasoning better in this live performance:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0IUdjMcEmo

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this your analysis? I'm far from a novice in Music Theory (only knowledgeable it exists), but thing I'd love to see next would be generating a song through a Markov Chain, or even by applying a genetic algorithm and having viewers vote on their favorite renditions. I've always wanted to take the lyrics of popular songs and run them through a Markov Chain, just to see what could get produced. Ultimate goal would be…

Yeah, I'm on the Hooktheory team that wrote the article. I love your idea! We're 100% set up to do that kind of thing. It would certainly make an interesting, fun, social set of posts. Today was our first exposure to the world and the feedback / ideas have been amazing. Thanks for the idea. - Chris

I also came here to suggest a Markov chain generator using your data. I know nothing about music but it seems your analysis also needs to include information about timing (A is followed by B within X ms, C within Y ms, etc.) and some sort of clustering information that would allow choruses to be produced (e.g. identify clusters + cluster timing then information about the chords within the clusters).

Even better would be if you guys released your data and allowed other people to come up with creative ways of analyzing and using it ;) I actually have an idea that I think could work quite well and I'd love to build it but lack the data.

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#169

What he's really talking about is chord progression (while he doesn't really say that, it's essentially the description of his first few paragraphs). Most university-level music classes discuss common chord progressions. As he notes, the I, IV and V chords are the most common to appear in a song. It's a great article, but I think he may have done a lot of work to find out something that is fairly common knowledge lol…

This is an interesting generic Chord Progression Map: http://mugglinworks.com/chordmaps/genmap.htm

This page contains the specific Chord Progression Maps for all twelve keys: http://mugglinworks.com/chordmaps/chartmaps.htm

Re: I analyzed the chords to 1300 popular songs for patterns. This is what I found.

#170

Snnnzx.. wha? This may best thought of as a lexical analysis of 1300 popular novels. E.G. what is the most popular word following the word "it". The key of a tune 'controls' the chords available, using a typical chord progression. A song in the key of C most typically has the progression C-F-G or I-IV-V in roman numerals signifying 1 for the dominant C, and 4 and 5 for F and G respectively the fourth and fifth notes…

Charting chord progressions definitely sounds interesting. Would also like to see that based on musical style -- i.e. "blues" vs. "rock".

Already done (but not per musical style). See http://mugglinworks.com/chordmaps/genmap.htm for a generic Chord Progression Map, and http://mugglinworks.com/chordmaps/chartmaps.htm for specific maps for all twelve keys.
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