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Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

nature.com

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Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#61

Post by anthony_d »

lolinder wrote: post #51
nikanj wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People do joke about being dangerous without their morning coffee, but I have yet to see a coffee addict breaking into vehicles to score their morning fix. Also I have never had to worry someone is going to mug my loved ones to get some quick cash for a double-double. And have you ever heard of someone who skips important appointments because they stayed out getting high on caffeine instead Pretending caffeine is as…

> Pretending caffeine is as detrimental to our society as e.g. fentanyl is prime intellectual dishonesty. These are your words, not OP's. OP isn't claiming that caffeine is as bad as any other drug. They're claiming that it, like other drugs, is likely to have negative health effects that outweigh positive ones and that it's interesting that it gets a special place in our culture while other drugs get banned and shun…

> They're claiming that it, like other drugs, is likely to have negative health effects that outweigh positive ones

That alone is a strong and unsupported statement. Drugs frequently involve tradeoffs, but saying the negative out weighs the positive is not the same thing.

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#62

Post by ta988 »

hnthrowaway0328 wrote: post #50
austin-cheney wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All stimulants enhance some functions to some degree, so that is a poor metric of value. Cocaine, for example, temporarily boosts intelligence, but consuming cocaine is not recommended.

I heard investment bankers rely on it from the 90s. How addictive it is?

A lot.

And what's "funny" for bankers is that the return on investment is clearly negative. It degrades your cognitive function over time, your nose if it is used by that route, your relations, etc

like every psychostimulant (caffeine as well and roughly to the same extent), short term low dose use has some positive cognitive impact, but it goes down with repeated use and/or increased doses.

in the end not really worth it if your objective is cognitive enhancement (and not talking about the societal impact in the zones of production, which at least with coffee you can control a little)

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#63

Post by BuggieSmalls »

kachapopopow wrote: post #28
BossingAround wrote: post #16

Anyone with anxiety or sleep issues should reexamine their caffeine usage. Maybe those problems do not stem from caffeine, but maybe they do. I don't know many people that do not consume caffeine regularly, at least once a day - in such cases, you cannot know whether your anxiety, sleep problems, general tiredness, bad moods, ... are or are not caused by one's caffeine consumption. Some people swear by drinking a sho…

Caffeine makes me very sleepy if I drink it mid-day and I do in fact usually fall asleep early.

Exactly the same experience here. I have ADHD. Caffeine seems to give me a parallel (albeit lesser overall) experience to taking my prescribed Adderall.

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#64

Post by asats »

mhb wrote: post #29
velcrovan wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people should be able to do what they want with their time. I don’t think people should have to sell their labor for a wage in order to live. I wonder what happens to your opinions about caffeine in a society where owners have little to no leverage over workers, or where the workers are generally also the owners.

What kind of tea do they serve in the gulag?

Unironically this kind: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chifir

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#67

Post by DontchaKnowit »

kkielhofner wrote: post #53
ilaksh wrote: post #30

I love my caffeine. But caffeine is an addictive, highly profitable substance. So advertising it and trying to promote it as somehow having real health benefits is widespread. I would not be surprised if routine consumption of caffeine was at least mildly detrimental to health. I think some drugs have managed to gain a special place in our society . Advertising and lobbying warps our perception of these drugs. I even…

> highly profitable substance Yes and no. I've been a fan of caffeine pills for years. They are very cheap, readily available (portable), and most importantly to me offer completely consistent dosing. With caffeine pills I'm able to ensure I stay below the FDA recommended maximum daily intake of 400 mg (worst case). Another fun bonus - when a physician asks you what your caffeine intake is and you respond in milligra…

caffeine pills are awesome for the reasons you described, but I do find that coffee "feels" different as a result of the Monoamine oxidase inhibitors (probably). coffee feels more pushy and dirty - more peripheral nervous system stimulation

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#68

Post by amanaplanacanal »

nikanj wrote: post #44
ilaksh wrote: post #30

I love my caffeine. But caffeine is an addictive, highly profitable substance. So advertising it and trying to promote it as somehow having real health benefits is widespread. I would not be surprised if routine consumption of caffeine was at least mildly detrimental to health. I think some drugs have managed to gain a special place in our society . Advertising and lobbying warps our perception of these drugs. I even…

People do joke about being dangerous without their morning coffee, but I have yet to see a coffee addict breaking into vehicles to score their morning fix. Also I have never had to worry someone is going to mug my loved ones to get some quick cash for a double-double. And have you ever heard of someone who skips important appointments because they stayed out getting high on caffeine instead Pretending caffeine is as…

Only drugs that have artificially high prices caused by having no legal source lead to addicts committing crime to find their habit. Caffeine and alcohol are cheap and easily available.

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#69

Post by chmod775 »

eightysixfour wrote: post #40
austin-cheney wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All stimulants enhance some functions to some degree, so that is a poor metric of value. Cocaine, for example, temporarily boosts intelligence, but consuming cocaine is not recommended.

Does cocaine temporarily boost intelligence? I thought it boosted the feeling of being intelligent.

> Does cocaine temporarily boost intelligence? I thought it boosted the feeling of being intelligent.

For people who lack confidence or an ego, this may very well be the same thing.

Just the urge to prove myself got me far in life. Sometimes I clearly struggle more than others, especially when surrounded by extremely smart people at university, but at the end of the day I've gotten much further than those who capitulated at the very beginning, claiming they're not smart enough.

At this point I've taught things considered hard to a fair number of people, and those who give up for no objective reason at all vastly outnumber those who really (probably) can't do it. You can tell someone "it will probably take you twenty hours to understand this", and they'll still throw their hands in the air after one hour and declare they can't do it or just silently quit.

Being a quitter is as bad as being stupid. Worse, because it's also a waste.

So maybe instead of doing drugs, try to scrounge up some arrogance, confidence, pride, whatever it takes to make you hang in there.

Re: Caffeine suppresses cerebral grey matter responses to chronic sleep restriction

#70

Post by istjohn »

themaninthedark wrote: post #45
BossingAround wrote: post #16

Anyone with anxiety or sleep issues should reexamine their caffeine usage. Maybe those problems do not stem from caffeine, but maybe they do. I don't know many people that do not consume caffeine regularly, at least once a day - in such cases, you cannot know whether your anxiety, sleep problems, general tiredness, bad moods, ... are or are not caused by one's caffeine consumption. Some people swear by drinking a sho…

What about those of use who may or may not have ADD and have been using caffine to regulate our mood and focus.... I honestly can't tell at this point if the coffee is helping me focus and I have ADD or if I am just lazy(or depressed) and the coffee is helping get me motivated.

You might want to get diagnosed so you can get a proper ADHD prescription. I'm told Vyvanse is like a smooth day-long caffeine high without the jitters or stained teeth. OTOH, if caffeine is working for you, it sounds like it's performing the same function ADHD medication does for my loved one.
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