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Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

abc.net.au

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Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#31

Post by [deleted] »

01HNNWZ0MV43FF wrote: post #9
zug_zug wrote: post #4

It's really scary how a tiny amount of a mineral can permanently damage the human mind. I have to admit there's a part of me that almost wants to be skeptical, that mg of a rock could overcome the wonderous self-aware human mind. Every so often I have to remind that skeptical piece of me that it's an idiot and that every human alive is wildly fragile to any number of elements and chemicals. ------ Onto the article, i…

Well as they say, an entire human body is just > Water (35 L), Carbon (20 kg), Ammonia (4 L), Lime (1.5 kg), Phosphorous (800 g), Salt (250 g), Saltpeter (100 g), Sulfur (80 g), Fluorine (7.5 g), Iron (5 g), Silicon (3 g) and trace amounts of fifteen other elements. (The amounts are off somewhat but you get the idea)

[deleted]

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#32

Post by bell-cot »

wcoenen wrote: post #30
01HNNWZ0MV43FF wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well as they say, an entire human body is just > Water (35 L), Carbon (20 kg), Ammonia (4 L), Lime (1.5 kg), Phosphorous (800 g), Salt (250 g), Saltpeter (100 g), Sulfur (80 g), Fluorine (7.5 g), Iron (5 g), Silicon (3 g) and trace amounts of fifteen other elements. (The amounts are off somewhat but you get the idea)

This list is a mix of chemical substances (e.g. water), categories of substances (e.g. salt) and elements (e.g. carbon), so it doesn't really make sense. It would make more sense to stick to elements, e.g. list hydrogen and oxygen instead of water. Also, ammonia is very toxic and only exists in trace amounts in the body. Apparently it's a quote from the manga series Fullmetal alchemist.

This. But compared to the fluorine, ammonia is not particularly toxic.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#33

Post by cmrdporcupine »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #7
cjs_ac wrote: post #3

Lead poisoning in Australian mining towns is a surprisingly contentious issue. Town mayors usually try to cover up and deny any evidence of lead poisoning, because without the mines, there is no town. The broken hill that the town of Broken Hill is named after no longer exists. The mullock heap pictured in the article is all that remains: the entire hill was dug away when the original mine was active. As you can see…

> Town mayors usually try to cover up and deny any evidence of lead poisoning After moving to the West from a developing country was surprised to discover that things our politicians do for a big bribe western politicians sometimes do for free.

That's because the seat of power in the west is not with governments at all, but with business. The gov't ends up being there to keep them happy and avoid conflicts between them.

They've mostly stripped themselves of the ability to do anything they could be bribed over.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#34

Post by endemic »

lostlogin wrote: post #26
bloopernova wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1: Place 10e9 x ingredients on surface of habitable zone planet around young star. 2: Agitate water via tidal action, allow small amounts to dry and flood multiple times. 3: Add sunlight and electrical storms. 4: Wait 4 billion years.

You heathens do things so slowly. It takes a week and someone needs to find the apple snake. /s

You jest, but sometimes I wonder which is more likely.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#35

Post by thfuran »

bell-cot wrote: post #29
zug_zug wrote: post #4

It's really scary how a tiny amount of a mineral can permanently damage the human mind. I have to admit there's a part of me that almost wants to be skeptical, that mg of a rock could overcome the wonderous self-aware human mind. Every so often I have to remind that skeptical piece of me that it's an idiot and that every human alive is wildly fragile to any number of elements and chemicals. ------ Onto the article, i…

> If I ran a country, I'd collect health data on all my towns (perhaps blood tests of 1% of the population each year). And maybe flag 0.1% of your population for lots of medical testing, for their whole lives. Partly to catch unsuspected stuff, partly to have really solid baseline statistics. And if some of those those tests are widely know to be less-than-pleasant (bone marrow sampling, colonoscopy, etc.), and the b…

>and the busybodies & hypochondriacs find it easy to get on "the list"

If it's not a random sampling, is not nearly as useful.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#36

Post by gwervc »

soulofmischief wrote: post #12
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Town mayors usually try to cover up and deny any evidence of lead poisoning After moving to the West from a developing country was surprised to discover that things our politicians do for a big bribe western politicians sometimes do for free.

The money just flows through different channels, but that's a funny observation.

Exactly, corruption is more sophisticated, but it exists and is huge nonetheless. The big difference is that the starting GDP is higher, which allows for a little more to reach normal citizens after corruption is taken into account.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#37

Post by bell-cot »

thfuran wrote: post #35
bell-cot wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I ran a country, I'd collect health data on all my towns (perhaps blood tests of 1% of the population each year). And maybe flag 0.1% of your population for lots of medical testing, for their whole lives. Partly to catch unsuspected stuff, partly to have really solid baseline statistics. And if some of those those tests are widely know to be less-than-pleasant (bone marrow sampling, colonoscopy, etc.), and the b…

>and the busybodies & hypochondriacs find it easy to get on "the list" If it's not a random sampling, is not nearly as useful.

True-ish. But:

- You're free to keep track of how each person ended up on the list

- Your supply of "random volunteers" for life-long medical testing may be limited

- The costs/benefits of being a health busybody or hypochondriac, in the context of a wide variety of diseases and maladies, is itself worth study

- At the "I run a country" level, ensuring long-term political support for good healthcare is as important as ensuring that your current healthcare system is good.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#38

Post by FredPret »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #33
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Town mayors usually try to cover up and deny any evidence of lead poisoning After moving to the West from a developing country was surprised to discover that things our politicians do for a big bribe western politicians sometimes do for free.

That's because the seat of power in the west is not with governments at all, but with business. The gov't ends up being there to keep them happy and avoid conflicts between them. They've mostly stripped themselves of the ability to do anything they could be bribed over.

I don't know man. The US government spends in a couple of months what the biggest companies are worth in total.

According to this [0] Uncle Sam is obligated to spend 6.3T this year. That's 500B per month. Compare to the market cap of mammoth companies [1]. ExxonMobil, UnitedHealth, and Mastercard are all in the top 20 US companies and worth around one month of government spending.

How can a whale be beholden to a flea?

[0]: https://www.usaspending.gov/explorer/budget_function [1]: https://companiesmarketcap.com/

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#39

Post by cmrdporcupine »

FredPret wrote: post #38
cmrdporcupine wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because the seat of power in the west is not with governments at all, but with business. The gov't ends up being there to keep them happy and avoid conflicts between them. They've mostly stripped themselves of the ability to do anything they could be bribed over.

I don't know man. The US government spends in a couple of months what the biggest companies are worth in total. According to this [0] Uncle Sam is obligated to spend 6.3T this year. That's 500B per month. Compare to the market cap of mammoth companies [1]. ExxonMobil, UnitedHealth, and Mastercard are all in the top 20 US companies and worth around one month of government spending. How can a whale be beholden to a fle…

How much of that is defense? How much is security & policing?

A bulk of that spending is to keep the market going, and to protect business interests.

Re: Sparrows may be 'canary in the coal mine' for lead poisoning in children: study

#40

Post by teruakohatu »

cjs_ac wrote: post #3

Lead poisoning in Australian mining towns is a surprisingly contentious issue. Town mayors usually try to cover up and deny any evidence of lead poisoning, because without the mines, there is no town. The broken hill that the town of Broken Hill is named after no longer exists. The mullock heap pictured in the article is all that remains: the entire hill was dug away when the original mine was active. As you can see…

You weren't kidding, that one mine has polluted a significant percentage of the entire earths surface [1]:

> "The idea that Amundsen and Scott were traveling over snow that clearly was contaminated by lead from smelting and mining in Australia, and that lead pollution at that time was nearly as high as any time ever since, is surprising to say the least."

> The similar timing and magnitude of changes in lead deposition across Antarctica, as well as the characteristic isotopic signature of Broken Hill lead found throughout the continent, suggest that this single emission source in southern Australia was responsible for the introduction of lead pollution into Antarctica at the end of the 19th century and remains a significant source today, the authors report.

[1] https://web.archive.org/web/20140808070623/http://www.nasa.g...

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