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What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

nautil.us

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Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#41

Post by trhway »

linearrust wrote: post #3

> Defined as large-bodied terrestrial mammals with a mean adult body mass of 2,200 pounds or more, today’s remaining megaherbivores comprise the likes of elephants, rhinoceroses, giraffes, and hippopotamuses. Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? > I think work over the past few decades has rather…

>I have a hard time believing that hunter gathers in tiny tribes traveling on foot with primitive weapons could have hunted and wiped out entire species of large animals from continents

last mammoth died just 4000 years ago on an Arctic island - i.e. without humans they survived far longer even in pretty harsh conditions.

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#42

Post by Zanfa »

adolph wrote: post #34
hanniabu wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plus cameras and drones

Wild hogs seem to handle it pretty well

They also start breeding at < 2 years, can have multiple litters per year of 10+ piglets. Rhinos mature at 5 years (10 for males) and the gestation period for a single calf is 15 months.

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#43

Post by b112 »

adolph wrote: post #34
hanniabu wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plus cameras and drones

Wild hogs seem to handle it pretty well

Open season has been now called for wild "super" hogs in some areas, and that makes a difference. Pregnant sows, young hogs are now OK to kill any time in these areas.

Hunting 1000s of years ago didn't include "don't kill the pregnant animals, or children". It meant "I'm hungry" and "food".

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#44

Post by dghughes »

deadbolt wrote: post #15
linearrust wrote: post #3

> Defined as large-bodied terrestrial mammals with a mean adult body mass of 2,200 pounds or more, today’s remaining megaherbivores comprise the likes of elephants, rhinoceroses, giraffes, and hippopotamuses. Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? > I think work over the past few decades has rather…

> The most devastating blow for the buffalo, wolves, bears, etc was habitat loss. Wasn't the most devastating blow to Buffalo the campaign by settlers to slaughter them, since they were important to the native Americans?

I think the word buffalo really confuses people.

Bison are in North America while buffalo (small b) are in Asia and Africa.

>Wasn't the most devastating blow to Buffalo the campaign by settlers to slaughter them

I hope everyone in the city of Buffalo, NY are OK lol

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#45

Post by b112 »

nkrisc wrote: post #10
linearrust wrote: post #3

> Defined as large-bodied terrestrial mammals with a mean adult body mass of 2,200 pounds or more, today’s remaining megaherbivores comprise the likes of elephants, rhinoceroses, giraffes, and hippopotamuses. Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? > I think work over the past few decades has rather…

> Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? Consider that African megafauna have co-existed with early hominids and eventually humans for millions of years. They may have simply adapted to human predation successfully enough to survive, as one factor. Whereas in North America and elsewhere you have th…

Whereas in North America and elsewhere you have the sudden (on the evolutionary time scale) arrival of Homo Sapiens who are likely already very skilled and advanced hunters among a population of prey animals that have never experienced such a predator.

On some islands off the Northern coast of BC, there are dwarf deer that locals just walk up to, and smack on the head with a baseball bat. Right or wrong, it sort of highlights the point.

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#46

Post by christkv »

linearrust wrote: post #3

> Defined as large-bodied terrestrial mammals with a mean adult body mass of 2,200 pounds or more, today’s remaining megaherbivores comprise the likes of elephants, rhinoceroses, giraffes, and hippopotamuses. Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? > I think work over the past few decades has rather…

They are guessing. Probably a ton of compounding factors rather than a single one. Ice age (probably a big one for anything not in Africa), hunting, habitat compression, food competition, etc. I'm also guessing :)

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#47

Post by simonh »

mr_toad wrote: post #9
linearrust wrote: post #3

> Defined as large-bodied terrestrial mammals with a mean adult body mass of 2,200 pounds or more, today’s remaining megaherbivores comprise the likes of elephants, rhinoceroses, giraffes, and hippopotamuses. Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? > I think work over the past few decades has rather…

> Was there difference in hunter-gatherers in europe/asia/americas compared to africa? Why hadn't the ancient elephants, giraffes, etc been hunted to extinction? One theory is that they gradually adapted as humans developed. Once humans spread out to other continents the change was too rapid for the megafauna on those continents to adapt.

Also there were megafauna extinctions in Africa, just over a longer period of time. Then humans expand out of Africa, and within a few tens of thousands of years most of the extra-African megafauna are gone.

Re: What Happened to Ancient Megafauna?

#48

Post by Keysh »

The (Nautilus) article is confusing in the way it conflates "megaherbivores" (herbivores weighing more than 1 [metric] ton) and "megafauna" (any animal, regardless of what it eats, weighing more than 45 kg[1]).

Also: "Giant ground sloths, musk oxen, and short-faced kangaroos: All have gone the way of the dodo" -- A) Of those three animals, only the giant ground sloth was big enough to qualify as a megaherbivore; and B) musk oxen are very much not extinct!

[1] Which I assume is a translation of an older definition using 100 lb as the lower limit.

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