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Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

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Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#31

Post by BJones12 »

anthonyeden wrote: post #28

I can’t answer your question directly, but I will chime in and mention a parallel space where a number of small creators have built solid businesses - church visuals. Many churches want motion backgrounds to project behind their lyrics, so companies such as StoryLoop, CMG, Shift Worship, etc. have sprung up to serve this niche. The general business model is an annual subscription to access all their media. Monthly su…

I was going to mention this as well. I don't know the relative market size compared to bar/nightclub music, but it's solid and is expected to continue. Seems like LED screens are becoming ubiquitous in that space. And the product could move beyond just the under-lyric visuals to include lyric-video-like lyrics sequences triggered via MIDI from Ableton.

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#32

Post by ddtaylor »

poopsmithe wrote: post #30

If you're having trouble making it as the concert visuals guy, perhaps you could try being the Bitcoin concert visuals guy. Others have made a point that using Bitcoin in their marketing can drive 10% more sales.

It can also drive people away.

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#33

Post by Liquix »

metadat wrote: post #24
chabes wrote: post #2

Great work. I checked out your concert visuals 2024 reel. There is definitely work out there for folks that are familiar with techniques such as datamosh and generative visuals. People are familiar with them, since they have seen them used before, but most folks don’t know how to wield them. I’m not a business person, but have been involved in visuals for almost 20 years. I have done paid gigs that were one off thing…

That "Concert Visuals Showreel 2024" is bonkers, it seems similar to a demoscene piece but on even more crack and psychadelics. Intensely provocative, and easy to imagine it up on a huge screen. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO__MXVHjy8

it's absolutely nuts live especially at bass-heavy shows. a lot of the smaller guys have really good stuff, but Excision's visuals are the andromeda/farbrausch tier of VJ production imo:

https://inv.tux.pizza/watch?v=j4oF9JDnqgc

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#34

Post by mh- »

radley wrote: post #29
hluska wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did something similar during the rave days and the memories are making my blood pressure spike. It was the most annoying and time consuming way that I have ever lost a lot of money. I could have quite literally paid you $10,000 to waterboard me and it would have been cheaper, more efficient and about as pleasant.

Yeah, you really gotta love it to do it. Otherwise, it's like buying, hauling, setting up, and running your own sound and lighting system, then DJing from start to finish, and nobody noticing.

That last part is only true if everything went perfectly smoothly. Every single attendee will notice (or have it pointed out to them immediately) if your display glitches!

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#35

Post by fallinditch »

hluska wrote: post #23
fallinditch wrote: post #21

You could consider investing in a big screen and provide a more comprehensive service by renting it out for concerts and events. You could also reach out to companies that already do this.

I did something similar during the rave days and the memories are making my blood pressure spike. It was the most annoying and time consuming way that I have ever lost a lot of money. I could have quite literally paid you $10,000 to waterboard me and it would have been cheaper, more efficient and about as pleasant.

For sure, whatever business endeavor you undertake, it's important to plan and execute effectively. I mention this aspect of the Pro AV services industry because someone I know started this way and quickly built a significant business supplying and managing video displays for events like Glastonbury, major acts like U2. This is a significant and growing market:

"The global event pro-av services market size was valued at $28.6 billion in 2021, and is projected to reach $56.9 billion by 2031, growing at a CAGR of 7.1% from 2022 to 2031."

https://www.alliedmarketresearch.com/event-pro-av-services-m...

Adding the creative VDJ sugar on to could be a good niche.

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#36

Post by NateEag »

Many years ago I did freelance sysadmin work for a group that did stage lighting design for some really big names.

At first I was really puzzled how a guy could be running this thing from Lancaster PA and have all these contacts with huge musicians in LA, NYC, etc.

Eventually I realized that he'd been in the industry for decades and got to know a lot of these people over the years organically, from showing up and doing whatever it took to be involved.

All that to say that I have some reason to think the following advice is reasonable:

Get in touch with musicians directly. Find ones you gel with well, bend over backwards to make their shows amazing, and cultivate relationships for the long haul. You won't get rich, famous, or admired by normals, but you may get to be part of creating some beautiful moments for other humans.

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#37

Post by sho »

metadat wrote: post #24
chabes wrote: post #2

Great work. I checked out your concert visuals 2024 reel. There is definitely work out there for folks that are familiar with techniques such as datamosh and generative visuals. People are familiar with them, since they have seen them used before, but most folks don’t know how to wield them. I’m not a business person, but have been involved in visuals for almost 20 years. I have done paid gigs that were one off thing…

That "Concert Visuals Showreel 2024" is bonkers, it seems similar to a demoscene piece but on even more crack and psychadelics. Intensely provocative, and easy to imagine it up on a huge screen. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EO__MXVHjy8

OK, I checked it out too and I'm a little less impressed. I don't mean to knock the OP too hard, but I feel like I've been seeing the exact same "glitchy morphs in time to the music" for ever, like literally for decades.

Maybe that's just what people want and props to the creator for nailing the genre but I'd be way more interested in something actually unique and generated real time with the music. I feel like visualizers from the 2000s were more impressive - surely with all the progress in CPU/GPU we could be doing some truly epic visualizations these days...

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#38

Post by papertigerau »

radley wrote: post #22

First, the famous quote: "Why did I quit VJing? I was the first to arrive at the event and the last to leave. I brought and set up all my own gear, worked the entire time, and I got paid less than the coat check girl." - Hyperdelic Dave There are many ways to get into it, but for the most part it's all about direct connections. • Network with professional VJs, lasers, sound, and lighting services. You can work freela…

This is great advice! One build on "it's all about direct connections" theme - getting attention when you are starting out is EXPENSIVE. One option you have is start with asking for more time and attention from those people that are already paying you money through Patreon.

Great businesses come to resemble their customers (what they value becomes what your business values), and this only comes from an insanely deep understating of your customers. Talk with your patreons and ask "why" a lot - "why" should be your most used word. This can get a little awkward, so one trick is to set expectations early in the conversation with something like "I'm trying to understand how to make you more successful, so I'm going to ask why a lot because on the other side of that I can help you more."

A fantastic book to read (before you quit your job) is Four Steps to the Epiphany by Steve Blank. Good luck!

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#39

Post by joezydeco »

NateEag wrote: post #36

Many years ago I did freelance sysadmin work for a group that did stage lighting design for some really big names. At first I was really puzzled how a guy could be running this thing from Lancaster PA and have all these contacts with huge musicians in LA, NYC, etc. Eventually I realized that he'd been in the industry for decades and got to know a lot of these people over the years organically, from showing up and doi…

running this thing from Lancaster PA...

Rock Lititz isn't some tiny garage shop...

Re: Ask HN: How to grow a concert visuals business?

#40

Post by Carrok »

anthonyeden wrote: post #28

I can’t answer your question directly, but I will chime in and mention a parallel space where a number of small creators have built solid businesses - church visuals. Many churches want motion backgrounds to project behind their lyrics, so companies such as StoryLoop, CMG, Shift Worship, etc. have sprung up to serve this niche. The general business model is an annual subscription to access all their media. Monthly su…

I really can't express how different performing visuals at concerts vs a church is.

It's like someone asking "How do I get my river guide company off the ground?" and you reply "Well you could give tours of old folk's homes instead."

They're not even in the same category.

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