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The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

tomforth.co.uk

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Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#31

Post by csomar »

The OP starts with a very wrong comparison; essentially comparing the London area with the American average. A proper comparison will be to compare it against the Washington or NYC metropolitan area. The numbers will be different.

Then the article presents no arguments on how the UK can achieve such a feat other than having a bit better public transport. Public transport does certainly help and it’ll increase GDP; but I highly doubt it’s the determinant in creating the richest country per capita in the world.

As for “can”, any country theoretically can become super-rich. Singapore did. Whether it will or not is another matter. The UK had particular circumstances in the 1700-1900. It does not have the same circumstances today. Lots of countries are also racing toward this goal. The UK is certainly better positioned than most countries in the world but not the best positioned out there.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#32

Post by roenxi »

It has been 200 years since the industrial revolution - we know exactly what makes a society rich. Creating, or at least controlling, vast amounts of capital. Although it would be a mistake for the UK to be benchmarking itself against the rest of western Europe; much of the continent appears to be in trouble. The real question is why all the capital formation seems to have been in Asia for the last 50 years.

As for the UK, to get into such a position they're going to have to recognise that to get to this sort of state they can't have had pro-prosperity governance for decades. It takes 20-40 years for a lack of investment to start to show up in reality.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#33

Post by mr_toad »

ultimatewhip wrote: post #7
rapidaneurism wrote: post #5

And yet the northern muppets went and voted a Torrie government back in 2019 that took the UK out of the EU, causing a significant damage to the economy in the form of lost GDP. Something about bicycle front wheels and sticks, under the sound of tiny violins.

I think that is a bit unfair. Plenty of people living in cities in the north voted for Labour rather than the Conservatives. In 2019 constintuencies in Bradford and Leeds which were mentioned in the article voted Labour. The same problem exists in the USA where in a red state a county representing a large city votes Democrat but the rural areas or surburban enclaves vote Republican. Take Texas in 2020, Austin, Housto…

In the most recent general election the Labour Party had a landslide victory with only 1/3 of the popular vote. The first past the post system allots significantly more power than the vote actually mandates.

People like to joke that democracy is a tyranny of the majority, but the FPP system is more like a tyranny of the largest minority.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#35

Post by csomar »

throwup238 wrote: post #22
zwnow wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What makes you think we are generally happier? Europe is experiencing a right wing shift due to people being unhappy. The coming years won't be good for any of us to be honest.

The UK experienced that same right wing shift 14 years ago and is now dealing with the fallout. Europe is still in its honeymoon phase with the latest batch of right wing demagogues.

France very recently did a full 180.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#36

Post by JumpCrisscross »

j7ake wrote: post #28

“I think the UK can go back to being pretty much the richest country in the world per capita, at least as rich as the USA” said Matthew Clifford This sounds very arrogant and wishful thinking considering the trajectory of UK in the last 20 years. At the global stage, UK is as irrelevant as countries like Canada and Australia, but at least Canadians and Australians don’t openly claim they can be the richest country in…

> UK is as irrelevant as countries like Canada and Australia

The UK is the world’s 6th largest economy [1]. It clocks in next to India, the 5th. It is twice as large as Russia, the sick man of Europe and neighbourhood pest, and one of the other nine nuclear powers of the world [2].

The decline you cite is also the opportunity; if Britain could get its shit together, it could reasonably grow an entire Saudi Arabia (1%) or even Canada or Russia (2%) in a generation. (If it really clicked and maintained 3% growth for a generation, it would add to itself the entire economy of India.)

Never underestimate the advantage of starting ahead.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(no...

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_with_nuclear_...

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#37

Post by KingOfCoders »

"In 1920, North England’s economy as a whole was among the strongest in Europe and thus the world."

Exploiting and stealing always makes you rich. An empire doesn't make sense if you don't get rich with it (Also see the connection of Slavery and the British Industrial Revolution). The only problems: It's amoral stealing and exploiting others and it's not infinite, people don't want to be exploited so the empire gets more and more expensive to run.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#38

Post by ggm »

i2km wrote: post #18

Simple answer: no. The economy of SE England is largely comprised of: 1. Shuffling money around 2. Socialist-level ponzi government spending 3. A combination of property flipping and high-end property overseas sales used for tax evasion Innovation-wise, always looking for the easy wins without the hard work, unlike the US. As a Brit and former resident, happy to have emigrated and escaped the >50% (soon to be increas…

> As a Brit and former resident, happy to have emigrated and escaped the >50% (soon to be increased) tax rates.

Hah. So you don't believe in the Scandi high-tax economy, or the Dutch one?

Resentment of taxation is a perquisite of the rich, overwhelmingly. In fact, most people who are not rich pay reasonable rates of taxation except they pay far more percentage of their income as VAT/consumption taxes, which is of course nothing like 50%

"nineteen for you and one for me" was George Harrison whining about super tax in the 60s. This isn't new.

Re: The UK can go back to being the richest country in the world

#39

Post by twelvechairs »

j7ake wrote: post #28

“I think the UK can go back to being pretty much the richest country in the world per capita, at least as rich as the USA” said Matthew Clifford This sounds very arrogant and wishful thinking considering the trajectory of UK in the last 20 years. At the global stage, UK is as irrelevant as countries like Canada and Australia, but at least Canadians and Australians don’t openly claim they can be the richest country in…

Canada and Australia are rich by natural resources per capita. UK is rich by the history of the 19th and 18th centuries. I know which I'd bet on lasting.

Uk used to be top of the list for countries millionaires move to. It's rapidly fallen down that list over the last 10-20 years below those others mentioned now it's an exporter of wealthy individuals. That's big capital flight happening today

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