What's remarkable is Feynman went to great lengths in investigating the crackpot theories, instead of outright rejecting them. I won't even bother trying doing anything he mentions in the article, except for the esalen jaccuzi thing(wink wink). And I am pretty sure I will end up as Feynman did. Geeks and there "Well, actually" http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2011/Feb-17.html I think the point he is trying to make to…
Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
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Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#12As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#13As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
1. Mixes in? Is your charge that he tried to commit the fallacy of equivocation in some way? I'm not following how discussing the obvious abuse of integrity that Geller demonstrated and then the less-obvious abuse of integrity the psychology student demonstrated detracts from his point that integrity is really important to the usefulness of the Scientific method.
2. Seems to say? To me, he "seems to say" that a lack of integrity in the whole process is a commonly occurring characteristic of Cargo Cults. He seems to say that a lack of integrity diminishes the utility of the Scientific method.
3. You entirely missed the point of Feynman's education comment and the context of the part you quoted. Basically, he said that what we're doing to fix problems in education isn't working and we continue to rely on the same people and methods to fix them. The funny thing is that here we are almost 40 years after Feynman gave that address and we've never added the integrity that he spoke about to the process of improving education in America. As with the Cargo Cults, it's not surprising that results haven't improved.
4. This item/suggestion makes no sense. Feynman isn't proposing a holistic plan to fix the problem. The speech we're discussing was a commencement address to upcoming graduates from an institute that trains Scientists. Why wouldn't it be entirely appropriate to urge new Scientists to consider the importance of integrity to the Scientific method?
> Of course, Feynman was a genius in Physics, in his intuitive grasp [...]
I don't think you made one semi-solid point in your critique of this address by Feynman; but you're going to double-down and start to generalize about how Feynman was too quick to overgeneralize? Are you trying to be ironic?
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#14As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
I’m not sure his generalisations were really overgeneralisations. When you have a strong intuition about something, it’s going to be a real challenge to cast it into words for an audience that lacks that intuition. You can impart understanding but not sense —like explaining colour to someone blind from birth.
The beauty of his genius was that he managed to distill an important essence of Science into a relatively short and entertaining address that he could pass on to those new Scientists in hopes that they would grasp it as a useful concept that could be applied to their careers, the Scientific community, and to society in general.
The fact that we're still quoting it here on the Internet and thus passing on the wisdom is a nice bonus.
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#15As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
Perhaps you can't do controlled experiments with people that's fine, give up and go work on something else don't compromise and still call it science. Because your results are meaningless.
PS: How much useful information has been gained from human nutritional experimentation over the last 50 years?
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#16Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m not sure his generalisations were really overgeneralisations. When you have a strong intuition about something, it’s going to be a real challenge to cast it into words for an audience that lacks that intuition. You can impart understanding but not sense —like explaining colour to someone blind from birth.
Right. As was typical, Feynman had a level of understanding of a great many things that were difficult to convey to even some of the smartest people like a bunch of Caltech graduates. The beauty of his genius was that he managed to distill an important essence of Science into a relatively short and entertaining address that he could pass on to those new Scientists in hopes that they would grasp it as a useful concept…
And indeed, he even makes that exact point in this speech.
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#17Upon reading this paragraph, I was reminded of his book "What do you care what other people think", which was a homage to Arlene, partly because Feynman made the fatal mistake of trusting the doctor's judgement to disregard the blatantly obvious diagnosis. He wrote about his experience in much more detail here:
Part 1: http://i.imgur.com/CSNop.png
Part 2: http://i.imgur.com/7mDTW.png
--------------------------------------------------------- //Comments below are irrelevant to the thread, I just felt like sharing.
Feynman was depressed for a while but eventually his love for physics helped him recover. Hans Bethe once said, "Feynman depressed is just a little more cheerful then any other person when he is exuberant." Feynman is arguably the most logical and happiest human being that has ever existed.
Feynman's magnificent exuberance and puzzle solving enthusiasm remained up until his last days, where his coworker Christopher Sykes remarked "Look at this man. He faces the abyss. He doesn't know whether he is going to live through this week. But he was consumed by it, and he worked on it all day long...." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fzg1CU8t9nw#t=1h11m33s
A few days before his second operation, Feynman sang a bongos song about orange juice, an amusing take of Linus Pauling's advice to possibly cure his cancer. Just look at his smile at the end of this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKTSaezB4p8
I would also like to add that on Feynman's last days at the hospital, his last words to his artist friend Jirayr was "Don't worry about anything, go out and have a good time!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fzg1CU8t9nw#t=1h32m15s Maximus would be proud. "Death smiles at us all. All a man can do is smile back."
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#18As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
I think your criticisms miss the mark by a long shot. 1. Mixes in? Is your charge that he tried to commit the fallacy of equivocation in some way? I'm not following how discussing the obvious abuse of integrity that Geller demonstrated and then the less-obvious abuse of integrity the psychology student demonstrated detracts from his point that integrity is really important to the usefulness of the Scientific method.…
3. I think you missed my point here, based on your mentions of "same people" , "integrity", etc. Many, many approaches have been used to solve the education problem in the US in the past 40 years, some quite innovative, and not by the same people either. People from outside the field, like Feynman or more recently Bill Gates, think that the problem is just a case of idiots doing the same old thing, once you bring about the better methods, "integrity" (in this case perhaps may refer to teacher's ratings) and money, the problem may be solved relatively easily. As we have seen, that is not the case, because although the above sentiments contain most of the truth, there are other factors affecting the problem, too. The point is, unless you can attack all the factors at once, you won't be able to solve such deep sociological problems, which is why these require scientific++ approaches.
As for your tone, why not try to be a little more humble, rather than "makes no sense", "semi-solid" etc., why not "I didn't understand", even if the argument does suck.
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#19As always, many of Feynman's points are spot on. Yet, why do I get a sense of unease after reading this piece? I think his description of the scientific process is right, but its a bit too simplistic (of course, he was giving a address, not a lecture, but still). Specifically, 1. Very cleverly, he mixes in examples of absolute crackpottery (e.g Uri Geller, reflexology) with those of somewhat researchers (e.g. the psy…
His point is science is all or nothing. If you half ass it your simply wasting time. Perhaps you can't do controlled experiments with people that's fine, give up and go work on something else don't compromise and still call it science. Because your results are meaningless. PS: How much useful information has been gained from human nutritional experimentation over the last 50 years?
Similar problems that require a combination of statistics, biology, psychology, ethics, and politics:
* Should universities stop affirmative action, should they stop reverse affirmative action for Asians?
* Should we (like Norway) enact laws that require a certain percentage of women on company boards?
* Should there be gender equality (in the sense of numbers) in almost all professions? Are men (or women) more suitable for certain jobs?
etc., I'm sure you can think of many more.
Re: Richard Feynman’s Caltech Graduation Address on Integrity
#20Did not realize Feynman used meditation, isolation tanks, etc.! "First I started out by investigating various ideas of mysticism, and mystic experiences. I went into isolation tanks and got many hours of hallucinations, so I know something about that. Then I went to Esalen, which is a hotbed of this kind of thought (it's a wonderful place; you should go visit there). Then I became overwhelmed. I didn't realize how mu…
He played around with lockpicking too. Outstanding dude.