No more boot loader: Please use the kernel instead

Post by Denvercoder9 » Mon, Jul 08, 2024, 8:55 PM UTC

mjg59 wrote: post #80

Denvercoder9 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of machines are people using that entering the UEFI boot menu is difficult? On all three of mine I just press F10 during the first 5 or seconds the vendor logo shows, and I end up in a nice menu where I could select Windows, other kernels, memtest, or the EFI shell or setup.

One easy way to meet Microsoft's boot time requirements is to skip input device enumeration, so there's a lot of machines meeting the Windows sticker requirements where entering the firmware either requires a bunch of failed boots or getting far enough into the boot process that you can be offered an opportunity to reboot into the setup menu.

Post by kbolino » Mon, Jul 08, 2024, 8:55 PM UTC

mjg59 wrote: post #83

vlovich123 wrote: post #78

I really like the idea and the approach. I’m a little concerned however about the compatibility issues with kexec. For example, here’s what Arch says about the NVidia module: > The graphics driver needs to be unloaded before a kexec, or the next kernel will not be able to gain exclusive control of the device. This is difficult to achieve manually because any programs which need exclusive control over the GPU (Xorg, d…

There's no reason to load things like the nvidia driver if all you want to do is offer a choice to kexec into another kernel, which makes things easier - you can continue just using the display environment the firmware set up.

Post by yjftsjthsd-h » Mon, Jul 08, 2024, 8:57 PM UTC

alerighi wrote: post #45

It's something you can do since a lot of years. I used to do so 10 years ago, when I've got the first motherboard with UEFI. But is it useful? It saves a minimal time in the boot sequence, but at what cost? The bootloader (being it grub, or something more simple as systemd-boot) is useful to me for a couple of reasons: - it allows to dual-boot with Windows easily: motherboard boot menu is often not easy to access, yo…

Post by wongarsu » Mon, Jul 08, 2024, 9:00 PM UTC

pavon wrote: post #94

Denvercoder9 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of machines are people using that entering the UEFI boot menu is difficult? On all three of mine I just press F10 during the first 5 or seconds the vendor logo shows, and I end up in a nice menu where I could select Windows, other kernels, memtest, or the EFI shell or setup.

I was working on my Dad's Dell laptop this weekend, and no matter how quickly I spammed the correct key (F12 in this case) it would miss it and continue to a full boot about 3/4 times. I never figured out if it is just picky about timing, or if it had different types of reboots where some of them entering BIOS wasn't even an option.

Post by arp242 » Mon, Jul 08, 2024, 9:02 PM UTC

ta8645 wrote: post #7

drewg123 wrote: post #2

I personally think they're moving in the wrong direction. I'd rather have "NMIRFS" (no more initramfs). Eg, a smarter bootloader that understands all bootable filesystems and cooperates with the kernel to pre-load modules needed for boot and obviates the need for initramfs. FreeBSD's loader does this, and its so much easier to deal with. Eg, it understands ZFS, and can pre-load storage driver modules and zfs.ko for t…

The Linux kernel does not require an initramfs. You can build a kernel with everything compiled in; with no modules needed at all. Initramfs is used for generic kernels where you don't know beforehand which features will be required. This allows you to avoid wasting RAM on features you don't use. But it is optional.