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Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

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Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#111

Post by digging »

phoronixrly wrote: post #34

With regards to the end of the article. > Can I work for a bad company and still be a good person? > No. https://apenwarr.ca/log/20201121

And pretty much every company is bad. But this is a wrong answer because the question is actually nonsense.

The answer to "What happens when you move faster than light" is not "nothing", it is undefined because the question is invalid. Asking if a person or a company is good or bad isn't a question that can ever have a well-defined answer: the answers we give are rounded according to our own values. To get more specific, not all of us have a huge amount of choice in who we work for.

If apenwarr believes I want to be a good person they should hire me at Tailscale. What's that, they won't? They don't have openings, or I'm not qualified? I guess they're the bad person because now I have to work for a bad company or lose my income. And if I lose my income, my co-habitants lose their housing, and my donations to good causes dry up. Do I just not do enough good for apenwarr? They must be a paragon of virtue. Surely they don't eat meat, or even associate with meat-eaters. Surely they don't fly in airplanes.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#112

Post by CYR1X »

lakerz16 wrote: post #94

I hate TM and ridiculous fees as much as anyone, but this article is overly hyperbolic. There's a section named "Pirating Tickets", that just explains how to re-create a barcode that you already paid for. You're not using this to rob anyone of anything. And at the end, "Have fun refactoring your ticket verification system". Why? There are no vulnerabilities here. A rotating barcode (even if following a known pattern)…

It's piracy in a way that's analogous to ripping like Netflix content. You are breaking away from DRM which is piracy. They also cite the potential to have multiple tokens valid per one ticket which would let multiple people get in with the same ticket.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#113

Post by [deleted] »

jrockway wrote: post #76
oehpr wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to presume that the driving impetus of all of this is that they're trying to avoid the actual requirement of checking the ID. Like, they want to improve the flow of traffic through admissions. But I mean, obviously, any kind of system like this strikes me as the same sort of thing as DRM. That you can somehow protect the message from the person you're sharing the message to. How can you avoid reselling if you…

Yup exactly. Some events are pretty bad at opening the doors early. The Brooklyn Nets seem to open 30 minutes before the game, so they need to get 20,000 people through 20 metal detectors in 30 minutes. Every second extra they add to the process is a second you don't have to buy a $25 drink, and that's how they make their money. We check IDs for flights because airline yield management demands that there be no resale…

[deleted]

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#114

Post by photonbeam »

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #109
mattmaroon wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still don't blame the developers, I blame government. It's not the job of rank and file workers to police companies. I wouldn't work for LN, but I'm not going to blame someone else for doing so. We've all gotta feed our families. (I realize there's a line somewhere, you wouldn't excuse a prison guard at Auschwitz the same way, but I can't get too worked up about a developer making a ticketing app even if I hate the…

I mean would you say that developers who work for Facebook have crossed that line?

Depends on when they joined

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#115

Post by mattmaroon »

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #109
mattmaroon wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still don't blame the developers, I blame government. It's not the job of rank and file workers to police companies. I wouldn't work for LN, but I'm not going to blame someone else for doing so. We've all gotta feed our families. (I realize there's a line somewhere, you wouldn't excuse a prison guard at Auschwitz the same way, but I can't get too worked up about a developer making a ticketing app even if I hate the…

I mean would you say that developers who work for Facebook have crossed that line?

No. Not even close.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#117

Post by NavinF »

ilrwbwrkhv wrote: post #109
mattmaroon wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still don't blame the developers, I blame government. It's not the job of rank and file workers to police companies. I wouldn't work for LN, but I'm not going to blame someone else for doing so. We've all gotta feed our families. (I realize there's a line somewhere, you wouldn't excuse a prison guard at Auschwitz the same way, but I can't get too worked up about a developer making a ticketing app even if I hate the…

I mean would you say that developers who work for Facebook have crossed that line?

...by doing what? FB is one of the largest employers of people on this site. If you ran a poll, I'd expect the majority to answer "no" to your question. Of the people who answered "yes", I bet the majority would still accept an offer from FB if it was just 20k more than the next best offer.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#118

Post by fluoridation »

its_ethan wrote: post #77
jjmarr wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Buying something at a low price and selling it at a high price is arbitrage 101 and is free money. The "true solution" is to sell tickets at their actual market price instead of pretending that the face value of concert tickets isn't increasing due to a larger population and greater demand.

> Buying something at a low price and selling it at a high price is arbitrage 101 and is free money. A bit of a nit pick, but this isn't "free money" unless you have a guarantee that someone will actually buy at the higher price. You could buy low, be unable to sell, and end up eating the "buy low" cost. > sell tickets at their actual market price How do you know what their actual market price is? You have to open it…

I mean, it may very well have been criticized, but how is it any less fair than the alternative? As for being exploitative, that's kind of the point. The company figures for most shows it's leaving money on the table for scalpers to take. The other side of it is that if a show bombs the ticket prices can be reduced to encourage people to come.

To be honest, it seems overall a better solution.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#119

Post by lowdownbutter »

RScholar wrote: post #55

> Software developers are the wizards and shamans of the modern age. We ought to use our powers with the austerity and integrity such power implies. This is one of the most powerful truths underlying the world we currently inhabit. The sooner we can agree to behave accordingly, the better our prospects for ripping the reigns of society from the hands of those whose only animating principles are avarice and exploitati…

"In effect, we conjure the spirits of the computer with our spells"

t. Introduction of SICP

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#120

Post by rozap »

probably_wrong wrote: post #67
phoronixrly wrote: post #34

With regards to the end of the article. > Can I work for a bad company and still be a good person? > No. https://apenwarr.ca/log/20201121

I'm glad we cleared that up. Now all that remains is a good, measurable definition of what a bad company is.

It's not hard if you remove the self delusion. Removing the self delusion is maybe tricky for the individual, but it's easy for people around the individual to see. Societal tools like shame are generally used to encourage people in the right direction, but we don't do a great job of this in America, because money tends to override everything else and I don't think we have good structures around expressing non-monetary values like honor.

Especially on the west coast, we're so passive in our shaming of people that it probably doesn't translate to action. There are people who work at Evil companies like Facebook, etc, who are otherwise nice, but I find myself not including them or turned off to them as friends because this sort of contradiction is hard to square in my brain. Of course I wouldn't communicate to this, being a passive PNW raised wimp, and it's not even super explicit in my mind, it's really more of a bad vibe than anything else. I imagine over time if enough people act like I do, it doesn't actually translate to different decisions from the individual in question, but instead translates to them waking up one day feeling distant and unfulfilled, which is probably the worst of all outcomes. They still work for Bad Company, but are also sad about it, and there's a general sense of malaise pervading life that's hard to pinpoint.

*Obviously this all ignores the people who don't have a choice of employment. But here I'm generally referring to software people who have high pay and career mobility. Things get murkier when the conversation is opened up to people who are just trying to survive.

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