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How to think in writing

henrikkarlsson.xyz

61–70 of 131 posts

Re: How to think in writing

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things you write down stick better (according to school teachers) and if you write digitally you can look stuff up as you write. There are similar quotes about meditation and walking so they are all part of the same toolkit (and it is great if you can use any part of it).

> if you write digitally you can look stuff up as you write is that supposed to be a good thing? if the goal is developing ideas, i would wager that it's not.

Not every part of your ideas need to be novel and unadulterated by the rest of human progress. If your ideas need to fit in to some wider context (e.g. you need to produce working code) then it is very helpful to be able to look up important facts about that wider context rather than guessing.

Re: How to think in writing

#62
post #18
post #5

The PG quote is a hot take. Yes, writing can be a productive focusing mechanism, it can also provide you with good reflections. But so can meditation, so can a good walk. It's a tool, not a requirement. It also has it's own downsides in that it forces you to think a certain constrained way, and while that is also one of its strength, it does limit your ability to think creatively. Similar to how using ChatGPt to draf…

Can you give any examples of someone whose idea formation was not improved went they undertook the task of writing their thoughts down?

No, because we don't have access to the ideas of those who don't write them down.

Re: How to think in writing

#63
post #38

Though it can be blamed on myself, I didn't understand what you were saying. Your vocab and sentence structure is awesome, but your thoughts just aren't comming across.

Indeed i kind of felt similar. I'm just not sure what the thesis of this piece is supposed to be. Is it that to write deeply you should question your assumptions and follow your argument to their logical conclusions? Is there something more that i missed? Surely that goes without saying?

Here’s my (sometimes heavy-handed) restatement. The thesis is marked by asterisks.

The author’s expression tends toward the literary and thus reduces clarity by requiring more work from the reader — a point which I find ironic in light of the message conveyed.

- - -

> When I sit down to write … [m]y thoughts are flighty and shapeless … . But when I type, it is as if I pin my thoughts to the table. I can examine them.

> But it is hard to do it right. Not all writing helps me think. Most kinds of writing are rather weak, or even counterproductive, in this regard. You have to approach it in the right way.

> Until last fall, I had not seen anyone properly articulate the mental moves that make writing a powerful tool for thought. …

> But then I read Imre Lakatos’s Proofs and Refutations. … [I]t is, if you read it sideways, a profound exploration of the act of writing. … Because [mathematics is a special type of writing that tends toward great] precision, reading Lakatos gave me a clearer and more precise understanding of [how I use writing to] wrestle with my thoughts.

> **What follows is a series of meditations about thinking through writing provoked by, but not faithful to, Lakatos’s book. … [It] covers the basic mental models that are useful to most people [to use writing to clarify their simple thinking] … .** [A forthcoming essay will explore] more complex patterns of thinking which [may be] useful [in] research or … deep creative work.

> [First mental model: make fluid thinking rigid. That is, give yourself something to work with.]

> [Second mental model: make conjectures.]

> [Third mental model: unfold the conjectures. That is,] “interrogat[e] the conclusion to [hypothesize] why it could be true.” What premises and reasoning chains [could] lead[] to this conclusion? [This opens the conjectures up to greater criticism, which in turn helps to approach the truth, even if the explanation is wrong.]

> …

> [To make and unfold conjectures, I have learned to write a list of] bullet points [that attempt to explain] the intuition[s] behind [my conjectures as] a series of premises [that seem to fit together logically]. [Then I ask follow-up questions and try to find counter-examples.] [Through this process, I more readily find flaws in my thinking and discard or adjust my ideas on the fly.]

> [D]eeper patterns take a longer time to emerge … because they are further from … established thoughts and [therefore] harder to articulate.

> …

> [Writing is like generating] texts filled with hidden doors … . [We shortchange ourselves if we do not take the time and make the effort to open those doors and explore what lies behind them by asking critical questions about what we have written and by searching for general and special counter-examples.]

Re: How to think in writing

#64
post #23
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taking the statement completely out of context, it states : if A implies B, then not A implies not B. This is a logical flaw. The correct statement from a logical point of view is: if A implies B, then not B implies not A. In this case, even if writing down your ideas makes them more precise, there might be other methods that make your ideas more precise. Again this is just the logical point of view, out of context.

> Taking the statement completely out of context, it states : if A implies B, then not A implies not B. This is a logical flaw. The statement in TFA is not that though. Instead, it is "if A implies B, then not A implies not C." A: writing about thoughts B: thoughts become more complete C: thoughts are most complete If "A implies B" is true, then it also doesn't matter if other methods also make your ideas more comple…

What books can I read to reason like this?

EDIT: shortened sentence

Re: How to think in writing

#65
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed i kind of felt similar. I'm just not sure what the thesis of this piece is supposed to be. Is it that to write deeply you should question your assumptions and follow your argument to their logical conclusions? Is there something more that i missed? Surely that goes without saying?

Here’s my (sometimes heavy-handed) restatement. The thesis is marked by asterisks. The author’s expression tends toward the literary and thus reduces clarity by requiring more work from the reader — a point which I find ironic in light of the message conveyed. - - - > When I sit down to write … [m]y thoughts are flighty and shapeless … . But when I type, it is as if I pin my thoughts to the table. I can examine them.…

Perhaps i just have the wrong mental model on how people think, but this sounds like just a description of all human thought processes, whether writing deep thoughts or deciding what to eat for dinner. I honestly am not sure what the alternative would be.

Re: How to think in writing

#66
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here’s my (sometimes heavy-handed) restatement. The thesis is marked by asterisks. The author’s expression tends toward the literary and thus reduces clarity by requiring more work from the reader — a point which I find ironic in light of the message conveyed. - - - > When I sit down to write … [m]y thoughts are flighty and shapeless … . But when I type, it is as if I pin my thoughts to the table. I can examine them.…

Perhaps i just have the wrong mental model on how people think, but this sounds like just a description of all human thought processes, whether writing deep thoughts or deciding what to eat for dinner. I honestly am not sure what the alternative would be.

I tend to agree. The author appears to have discovered that he can better examine and criticize his own thoughts by making his thinking verbally explicit and then putting in effort to actually perform that examination (both mentally and through further writing).

I suppose there are other ways to work with the mind’s symbols, such as visual art, music, etc. But the author seems confined to language and language-based logic.

Re: How to think in writing

#67

The introduction to the article denies its main point: > If writing down your ideas always makes them more precise and more complete, then no one who hasn't written about a topic has fully formed ideas about it. It’s a logical error. It’s like saying: people who point out logical errors in internet comments look foolish, therefore no one who hasn’t done that looks foolish. Clearly there are other ways to look foolish…

No, it's like: people who point out logical errors in internet comments look more foolish - always, no matter what else they did - therefore no one who hasn’t done that looks perfectly foolish.

Or, say, people who have caught a Snorlax have more Pokemon, therefore no one who hasn't caught a Snorlax has all the Pokemon.

This assumes that there's such a thing as a "fully formed idea" (which means an exception to "always" - you can't clarify your thoughts more and more by writing about them forever). If there isn't, it's still true, but it's not saying a whole lot.

Re: How to think in writing

#68
post #13

> But then I read Imre Lakatos’s Proofs and Refutations . It is not, at first glance, a book about writing. It is a book of mathematical philosophy. By a Hungarian Stalinist, no less. I don't see what "Hungarian" has to do with it, and, though I do see what "Stalinist" might have to do with it, it probably shouldn't. (Someone's politics don't have to be good for them to make a valuable contribution to knowledge.) But…

> I don't see what "Hungarian" has to do with it

It's just additional information...

Re: How to think in writing

#70

The introduction to the article denies its main point: > If writing down your ideas always makes them more precise and more complete, then no one who hasn't written about a topic has fully formed ideas about it. It’s a logical error. It’s like saying: people who point out logical errors in internet comments look foolish, therefore no one who hasn’t done that looks foolish. Clearly there are other ways to look foolish…

That introduction is a quote with attribution Paul Graham, so the author of the blog did not write that and did not strictly commit that mistake.
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