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Should this be a map or 500 maps?

escapethealgorithm.substack.com

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Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#51

Post by bazzargh »

codetrotter wrote: post #39
dataflow wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another This might be a computational cost thing. Modern routing algorithms preprocess the graph to find the optimal route orders of magnitude faster than you normally would without preprocessing. If you let each person customize the graph then such queries would be much more costly. Then again, I'm sure there are lots of other complications already and that most users woul…

Hire some game devs that have worked on path finding in AAA games. They will find a way to partially pre process the map data in such a way that on-device computation can then let the user pick and choose what roads to favor and what roads to exclude. And as an added bonus they’ll be unrelentingly optimizing your map application to the point where the UI will run at 144 Hz ;)

Cyclestreets already built a custom bike routing engine that is used in a bunch of different cycle map apps/websites, and has been for over a decade

https://www.cyclestreets.net/help/journey/routing/

at the most basic level it lets you choose between fastest and quietest routes, understands hills, cycle paths, etc.

There's many, many other choices https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Routing

contraction hierarchies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contraction_hierarchies made cross-continent route planning practical and practically instant, eg in GraphHopper. A lot of the options listed there work offline.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#52

Post by themk »

leeoniya wrote: post #41
jorisboris wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m still looking for a map which let me optimize for “stopping as little as possible” which in practice means avoiding traffic jams and traffic lights. I notice this makes me drive more relax, and especially with a baby it’s way easier to keep the baby asleep

or "fewest turns". i would rather drive an extra straight 0.25 miles down a major road than to zig-zag through tiny side streets while trying to carefully pay attention to unfamiliar street names and/or constant nav app directions. i've had google maps instruct me to take four or five additional turns to save a couple hundred yards of driving.

Google maps is absolutely horrendous for this.

I've found OsmAnd to give me much better results. But google maps traffic awareness is pretty handy...

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#54

Post by lupire »

12907835202 wrote: post #43
nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

The biggest thing for me with maps is the refusal to allow multiple tabs on phone. If you're the passenger on a road trip and doing the navigation you're unable to use maps to make plans for tonight or tomorrow. Okay the driver could be nav, but now they also need to be the music, and everytime you the passenger wants to use it to look for petrol on route or change music you have to ask their code or hold it up to th…

Install Maps Go for another map, and set up a Work Profile for 2 more maps.

Or use Maps in abBrowser.

Interestingly, when you have public transit navigation running, Maps is able to run "current trip" in background while you plan an alternate/additional trip.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#55

Post by Retric »

12907835202 wrote: post #43
nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

The biggest thing for me with maps is the refusal to allow multiple tabs on phone. If you're the passenger on a road trip and doing the navigation you're unable to use maps to make plans for tonight or tomorrow. Okay the driver could be nav, but now they also need to be the music, and everytime you the passenger wants to use it to look for petrol on route or change music you have to ask their code or hold it up to th…

You can use multiple map apps at the same time on one phone.

Default + website (on multiple tap) are always available, but on long road trips I use Waze.

There’s also a bunch of really nice apps for things like subway maps, trails, etc.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#56

Post by philipwhiuk »

madeofpalk wrote: post #27
nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

I feel this a lot cycling in London. Both Apple and Google maps really wants you to cycle along the canals, which can be a huge pain especially on busy weekends. Thankfully I know some areas well enough and I just cycle through the path 10 metres "inland", but the maps constantly want me to do a u-turn and get back on the canal.

Need a 'commute cycling' mode and a 'leisure cycling' mode :)

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#57

Post by lupire »

nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

> It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another.

In the Directions mode, you can insert a map pin for a point you want to pass.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#58

Post by stevage »

nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

I have put enormous effort into building routable cycling maps over the years: https://stevebennett.me/2015/01/14/cycletour-org-a-better-ma...

It's frustrating to me that after all these years, I still end up using Google Maps mostly. I haven't really come across a general purpose mapping tool I can use for cycling directions and routing, both on desktop and on my phone, in cities and in the bush.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#59

Post by frederikvs »

nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

This is why I need to have 10 different map apps on my phone. I hate it.

Google maps is good enough for find my way in a city, or getting to a destination by car. And when I get there, I whip out another app to pay the parking. If I forget where I parked, my car has an app with a map. To plan a longer trip with an electric car, ABRP is better. And when I'm just looking for a charge pole where my card will work, Plugsurfing. If I want to use car sharing, another app with another map.

If I want to go for a run or a hike, outdooractive has some routes. Komoot has some others. But if I want to find some rock climbing routes, I need 27crags. Meanwhile, my sports watch also has a map which can show me the route I just ran.

None of these are fundamentally different. All show a very similar map, just with other points of interest, other routes, other layers, other navigation algorithms.

But all of these apps have different UI, different features, and just behave slightly differently.

I wish I could just have a single map app, where I enable the layers I'm interested in.

Re: Should this be a map or 500 maps?

#60

Post by sandworm101 »

jorisboris wrote: post #29
nicbou wrote: post #10

We had a lively discussion about Google Maps in my cycling group. It's very annoying to have a map that is only designed to show the fastest route, and that forcefully reroutes you to it. It doesn't let you avoid a road or favour another. It does not show named bike routes and hiking trails. It doesn't even let you keep the screen on without having directions. For most people, the entire experience of using a map is…

I’m still looking for a map which let me optimize for “stopping as little as possible” which in practice means avoiding traffic jams and traffic lights. I notice this makes me drive more relax, and especially with a baby it’s way easier to keep the baby asleep

Sportbike mode: route with least likelihood of speed traps, plus 1-minute warning ahead of known trap locations.

No-selfies mode: route with least cellphone coverage.

Horsebox mode: route with fewest intersections and the most sportbikes.

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