Crypto breakthrough shows Flame was designed by world-class scientists

Its non-trivial building these submarines and most competent engineers would balk at being asked to, explaining they were not competent enough.

Don't mistake a lack of polish, fanfare and machined parts for primitive as in easy to make work.

This is unprecedened. I chose $800B as an absurdly large sum that I believe is more than Academia would spend on this question in a few years. (I could be wrong though.)

Downvoter: I know you think it's not secure if a trillion dollars of research can break it - but guess what: there is a nonzero chance that between here and 800 billion dollars from here there is a quantum device. that doesn't mean it actually exists. it means it could exist if one of the world's biggest economies throws that much military R&D at it. I'm saying they shouldn't. at least, not with that goal (breakig crypto for everyone; quantum computing itself is a welcome advance). Please be more practical.

And it amuses me, because, you have an example right in your backyard: the "middle america" has tens of millions of people that want to live in a Christian state, with no evolution teaching in schools, no abortions, no gay marriages, the death penalty, Bible, etc. Those people are not "forced by the state" to want to live like so. If anything, they think the state FAILS them by not being more christian.

If you consider this --that even within the US there are people who want those kinds of things--, you might understand why your San Franciscan or whatever ideas are not directly applicable to muslim countries, with a much different history and culture than what the US has.

Just saying.

notice how a.) it's not even desirable to be a nation state, so untwist your knickers everybody:

"The most obvious impact of the nation state, as compared to its non-national predecessors, is the creation of a uniform national culture, through state policy. The model of the nation state implies that its population constitutes a nation, united by a common descent, a common language and many forms of shared culture. When the implied unity was absent, the nation state often tried to create it. It promoted a uniform national language, through language policy. The creation of national systems of compulsory primary education and a relatively uniform curriculum in secondary schools, was the most effective instrument in the spread of the national languages. The schools also taught the national history, often in a propagandistic and mythologised version, and (especially during conflicts) some nation states still teach this kind of history.[10]

Language and cultural policy was sometimes negative, aimed at the suppression of non-national elements. Language prohibitions were sometimes used to accelerate the adoption of national languages and the decline of minority languages (see Germanisation)."

Sure, when America was by and for white upper class males, it was a nation state, or something. Good for you, can we move to today now?

The clincher is the list of examples of nation states on that page. Read it. Notice how the USA isn't on the list. So you can blah blah blah all you want, the downvoted poster is correct, the rest is not. What a surprise ^^