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FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

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Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#471

Post by practicemaths »

BobbyJo wrote: post #467
postmodest wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the same issue as Prop 65, and while we can all say "oh the law is bad" the real problem is _corporations are lazy_. Instead of making sure their products are safe, they just say everything is unsafe, because they know consumers will become numb to it. Our food shouldn't contain allergens, and our computer mice shouldn't give us cancer, but instead of taking the time to make sure of that, companies just tell…

> _corporations are lazy_ In market terms: "corporations try to be capital-efficient because they are competing with each other over price-sensitive consumers."

TBF laziness is the natural order to the universe. Ain't nothin doin more than it has to.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#472

Post by twic »

konschubert wrote: post #390
postmodest wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the same issue as Prop 65, and while we can all say "oh the law is bad" the real problem is _corporations are lazy_. Instead of making sure their products are safe, they just say everything is unsafe, because they know consumers will become numb to it. Our food shouldn't contain allergens, and our computer mice shouldn't give us cancer, but instead of taking the time to make sure of that, companies just tell…

I don’t know what the margins on bread are, but I would bet that they are tiny since this is a competitive market. Meaning that this kind of medical-lab-style cross contamination protocol will either raise the cost of the product or reduce the variety and choice.

> I don’t know what the margins on bread are

Well they're usually called crusts for starters.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#473

Post by andrewf »

brookst wrote: post #13
isaacfrond wrote: post #2

It's may favorite example of unintended consequences. FDA orders bakers to list allergens. There are stiff penalties if you are allergenic but don't list the allergen. So? Bakers claim their product contains allergens, even if they don't. FDA doesn't like it. So? Bakers add allergens on purpose, so they can rightly claim it contains them.

California proposition 65 is the classic example. Since it requires buildings to warn visitors if they contain cancer-causing substances, and since no landlord can possibly know every substance that even tenant or visitor might have, every building has a "this building may or may not contain cancer-causing substances" placard. It's surreal and awesome.

There's a warning when you step off the airplane onto the jetbridge at SFO.

Good luck refusing to get off the plane because you see the cancer warning and decide not to risk it.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#474

Post by int3 »

daemin wrote: post #464
int3 wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People generally don't develop allergies randomly in life. There's no insurance value here.

People can develop allergies during their lifetime, it's not just something that you're born with. There's also ongoing studies trying to desensitise people's allergies so that they can deal with foods more easily. So a person's allergy status can and does change during their lifetime. But my message was about the general principle of insurance being the very thing your comment was against. The situation where the va…

> People can develop allergies during their lifetime, it's not just something that you're born with.

Sure, but the likelihood of that is low enough that insuring against that isn't worth it for most people

> But my message was about the general principle of insurance being the very thing your comment was against. The situation where the vast majority of people pay some cost of which only a few need to utilise.

No, the principle of insurance is that people pay to hedge against some event that has a reasonable likelihood of happening to them at some point. Whether it's a majority or a minority paying for it is not central to the concept of insurance.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#475

Post by floxy »

dragonwriter wrote: post #163
floxy wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>when you go to the typical grocery store almost all the baked goods will be from Bimbo regardless of the label Are those those the only brands they produce? I only recognize 3 of those brands, and I can't even be sure I've ever eaten more than one of those. Maybe they are big only in certain regions?

> Are those those the only brands they produce? No, the five brands explicitly marked as a non-exhaustive list (with “such as”) are not, even close to, all of their brands. https://www.bimbobakeriesusa.com/our-brands

Your link is the same as the one gumby posted. I'm not seeing a listing of 5 brands, and Ctrl-f for "such as" results in 0 matches. On that page, I see 31 brands listed: Thomas, Sara Lee, Brownberry, Oroweat (sic), Entenmann's, Arnold, Lender's, Little Bites, Ball Park, Bays, Marinela, Bimbo, Maier's, Beefsteak, Boboli, The Cheesecake Factory, Mrs Baird's, Heiner's, Emmy's Organics, Grandma Sycamore's, Tia Rosa, Stroehmann, Nature's Harvest, Freihofer's, Wholesome Harvest, Goldminer, The Rustik Oven, Grace Baking, San Luis Sourdough, Alfaro's, and Tenderflake. Is this getting close to all of their brands?

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#476

Post by seatac76 »

gumby wrote: post #24

FWIW Bimbo (a Mexican company) is the largest baking company in north america -- when you go to the typical grocery store almost all the baked goods will be from Bimbo regardless of the label ( https://bimbobakeriesusa.com/our-brands )

Ohh wow, TIL. This is like that P&G chart, where in one mega corp just acquired majority brands in a business.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#477

Post by radicality »

quietbritishjim wrote: post #396
postmodest wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the same issue as Prop 65, and while we can all say "oh the law is bad" the real problem is _corporations are lazy_. Instead of making sure their products are safe, they just say everything is unsafe, because they know consumers will become numb to it. Our food shouldn't contain allergens, and our computer mice shouldn't give us cancer, but instead of taking the time to make sure of that, companies just tell…

> Our food shouldn't contain allergens, and our computer mice shouldn't give us cancer These things are not comparable. While adding sesame to everything to circumvent a law is certainly not fair, it is a reasonable ingredient to some products (whereas mice that give us cancer is, at the very least, not a goal). I like sesame buns! And, for young children, it's actually quite important to expose them to a range of al…

I’m European, and have been living in the US for a number of years and in Europe before that. It’s like some alternate reality here in the US, where peanuts, bread, and shrimp are out to kill a large part of the population. The article says they estimate 33M people in US to have food allergies which sounds insane to me.

I fully agree on exposure to these allergens when young. Have your child eat wide variety of foods, have them play out in the open and get dirty, have them play with animals, wash hands and keep clean but not to the point of sterility, etc.

One personal anecdote - when I was a few years old I apparently started having a lot of asthma-like coughing symptoms. We got a German shepherd, whom I would then play with, hug a lot, and sleep. My symptoms went away pretty quickly.

Similarly, my parents made sure I eat normal meals and not a ‘child’ diet. Eg I was never allowed to order from a ‘kids menu’. At home, salmon or shrimp for dinner and I don’t want it as a young child? Too bad, that’s dinner, eat that or go hungry (and of course I ended up eating and now love many cuisines and allergic to nothing).

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#478

Post by joshdotblack »

twic wrote: post #472
konschubert wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know what the margins on bread are, but I would bet that they are tiny since this is a competitive market. Meaning that this kind of medical-lab-style cross contamination protocol will either raise the cost of the product or reduce the variety and choice.

> I don’t know what the margins on bread are Well they're usually called crusts for starters.

Bravo

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#479

Post by s1artibartfast »

treflop wrote: post #458
s1artibartfast wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say probably and I guess that guesswork is what it comes down to. I think that p65 warnings are only slightly better than random in terms of identifying risky objects. I would guess they are only applied half the time if the item contains a known chemical, and half the time it contains a chemical, it has no label. Also, the threshold is so poor, you have no idea if an item is actually dangerous even if it is corr…

But isn’t that the case with everything? You can’t take anything at face value and never in history have you ever been able to. When you read a news article, you have to know about the publication before you can contextualize the article. When you read a restaurant movie review or rating, you have to know what the general average is and trends of the source before you can interpret the rating. When you read about som…

Sure, nothing is 100% trustworthy, but that doesn't mean everything is equal either. What I am saying is that p65 are an especially bad and noisy signal. The definitions provided by the state are garbage to start with, and then the utilization by private parties is especially inconsistent, with a large number (perhaps even a majority), using the label when they shouldn't or failing to use it when they should.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#480

Post by s1artibartfast »

flyinprogrammer wrote: post #192
s1artibartfast wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This story is about companies erring on the caution and labeling them with things like sesame even if they like don't contain it. The cost of proving it is sesame free and fines if they are wrong are not worth your business.

When companies install a handicap ramp in their business, it also incurs a cost. I don't blame the bread companies for their choice, and I'm in the minority now left with no choice but to boycott, and that's fine, their finance team likely said my dollars don't impact their bottomline, and they're likely correct. I also understand that a handicap ramp is likely considerably cheaper than retrofitting a manufacturing f…

Why do you think there is no consent? The products are labeled and nobody is force feeding you or your kid the bread.

They might not produce a product that you would like, but that is a lack of interaction, not coercion.

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