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Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

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Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#201

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

brodouevencode wrote: post #34
neaden wrote: post #3

This court continues to make decisions that might be defensible if you were making them for the first time, but go against decades of precedent in which time many laws have been written on the assumption that things would work a certain way. For a group that claims to be holding to tradition they sure are willing to throw things into chaos.

So if something that is seen as a bad idea should be kept in place because "that's the way we've always done it"?

To paraphrase Linus: If it's a bug that people depend on then it's not a bug- it's a feature.

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#203

Post by ldf80g804 »

mp05 wrote: post #167
callroomlamp wrote: post #118

Devastating that expertise will no longer influence the application of law and policy. The biggest question is who will interpret the application of law? Will it be challenged in court once again until a clear statement is made? Meanwhile, what will be the effects of this “deregulation” until a clear statement is made

Perhaps this will cause us to start electing experts instead of lifelong politicians? The number of doctors, engineers, and scientists in Congress is pathetic.

I keep telling people. Make stochastic democracy happen, where every 4 years randomly selected individuals populate the house to have a simple yay/nay vote on senate generated items ( senate can stay as is ). I used to joke about it, but I no longer think I am.

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#204

Post by tankenmate »

GenerWork wrote: post #153
Spivak wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but people who have been listening have also been dreading this coming for years. The fact that they're consistently knocking over shelves doesn't make it better. We've known that Roe was on the chopping block, but it doesn't make it good law even if it's consistent with the conservative justices' goals.

>Yes but people who have been listening have also been dreading this coming for years. Why are they dreading this? I find it strange how so many people are upset that the Supreme Court is forcing Congress to do its job, which is pass laws.

But the effect of this ruling will mean that Congress will have to pass an order of magnitude more laws; and there is only so much time for debates (which are required in order to pass laws). Or, executive bodies won't be able to do what is required to keep country wide productivity up.

This is the equivalent of requiring a stand up meeting for every commit to a repo; it's plainly obvious that over time it will kill USA's productivity. This is judicial drag on the economy.

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#205

Post by megaman821 »

dctoedt wrote: post #98

Time for Congress to start aggressively using its express constitutional power (under the Exceptions and Regulations Clause of Article III) to circumscribe federal courts' power to set aside congressional directives such as the ones that led to Chevron deference. "Separation of powers" is nowhere to be found in the Constitution; it's a bootstrapped creature of power-seeking judges.

If Congress had their shit together enough to reign in the federal courts, there wouldn't be so many federal laws that were ambiguous in the first place. Not sure what the shockwaves of this Chevron decision will be, but I am a fan of forcing the legislative branch to legislate again.

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#206

Post by jhp123 »

lolinder wrote: post #177
jhp123 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

who says that conservative justices have no rhyme or reason? Everyone knows they work shamelessly to advance their conservative political goals.

That's the same kind of argument I'm talking about, though. If you just frame it as "to advance their conservative political goals" then you fail to fully understand this court and will continue to be surprised by what they decide. This court has more than once ruled in a direction that conservatives would not like because the letter of the law required them to do so. Those instances just fail to make headlines and d…

continue to be surprised? I have not been surprised by this court whatsoever

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#207

Post by remarkEon »

consumer451 wrote: post #43

From Justice Kagan's dissent on page 82: > This Court has long understood Chevron deference to reflect what Congress would want, and so to be rooted in a presumption of legislative intent. Congress knows that it does not—in fact cannot—write perfectly complete regulatory statutes... > It knows that those statutes will inevitably contain ambiguities that some other actor will have to resolve, and gaps that some other…

> This Court has long understood Chevron deference to reflect what Congress would want, and so to be rooted in a presumption of legislative intent. Congress knows that it does not—in fact cannot—write perfectly complete regulatory statutes...

I really hope she meant to convey a different point here, because it reads as if congress doesn't care and wants unelected bureaucrats figuring out what laws mean because they themselves know they suck at writing those laws. If that is the case, then why even have congress?

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#208

Post by radley »

jimmyjazz14 wrote: post #100
sandworm101 wrote: post #87

So if courts aren't to defer to agencies on such matters, to where do they look? Congress? The executive? We can hate on regulatory agencies all day long, but they are least get stuff done. They show up to work and figure out how to move forwards. This decision seams a win for those political groups who, rather than actual fix anything, are bent on throwing sand into the gearbox.

"They get things done" has been one of the selling points for more than a few tyrannical regimes throughout history.

If I'm not mistaken, it's a selling point for functional governments too.

Re: Supreme Court overturns 40-year-old "Chevron deference" doctrine

#210

Post by kergonath »

epicureanideal wrote: post #12
badrequest wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corporations will run roughshod over regulators and everyday citizens' lives will be measurably worse as a consequence.

Not at all. They can still be sued, and lawmakers can still make laws. (edited, originally mistakenly wrote "regulators" can still make laws, which is exactly the wrong thing)

“The chicken will be fine, the structure is still there”, says the fox guarding the henhouse.
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