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FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

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Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#31

Post by starttoaster »

lylejantzi3rd wrote: post #8
isaacfrond wrote: post #2

It's may favorite example of unintended consequences. FDA orders bakers to list allergens. There are stiff penalties if you are allergenic but don't list the allergen. So? Bakers claim their product contains allergens, even if they don't. FDA doesn't like it. So? Bakers add allergens on purpose, so they can rightly claim it contains them.

It's closer to: FDA orders bakers to list allergens. There are stiff penalties if you are allergenic but don't list the allergen. So? Bakers look at their production processes and determine there's a chance that enough allergens get into the product due to cross contamination to list it on the label, just in case. FDA doesn't like it. They expect the bakers to fix their cross-contamination issues at great expense to…

It's closer to:

FDA orders bakers to list allergens. There are stiff penalties if you are allergenic but don't list the allergen.

So? Bakers look at their production processes and determine there's a chance that enough allergens get into the product due to cross contamination to list it on the label, just in case.

FDA doesn't like it. They expect the bakers to fix their cross-contamination issues at great expense to themselves.

So? Bakers add allergens on purpose, so they can rightly claim it contains them. It's cheaper than setting up a clean room for every product line.

FDA doesn't like it.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#33

Post by underseacables »

rdtsc wrote: post #27

So I don't get it why the bakeries didn't go for the "may contain" wording to start with. I guess one was the first to use "does contain" and then purposefully added sesame, everyone else thought that was particularly "clever" and copied it?

I think it has to do with the FDAs' extremely limited authority. To really remove a product, they have to use the federal trade commission to declare something as misbranded. Similar to what they do with dietary supplements.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#34

Post by umvi »

At this point it seems like it might be more effective to mandate the opposite: labels that indicate that the product is allergen free for X class of allergen.

That way the default (no label) = might contain allergens, and the presence of the label guarantees your safety.

Companies that take allergen cross contamination seriously can tout the label (and win the business of the allergic), companies that don't won't resort to purposefully including allergens in their product to avoid having to overhaul their cross contamination practices.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#35

Post by underseacables »

utensil4778 wrote: post #29
Molitor5901 wrote: post #15

This seems like splitting hairs on the part of the FDA. FDA officials acknowledged Tuesday that statements that a product “may contain” certain allergens “could be considered truthful and not misleading.” Bimbo officials have until July 8 to identify steps taken to remedy the issue — or to explain why the labeling doesn't violate FDA standards. So a baker.. who adds (insert allergy ingredient here), in minute quantit…

This is about sesame. Last year or so, the FDA changed the rules about sesame as an allergen. Some bakeries then decided to just slap "may contain traces of sesame" on everything so they didn't have to pay the cost of actually ensuring there's no cross-contamination. This has significantly harmed consumers who are actually allergic to sesame. Now there's effectively no way to know if a baked product will actually con…

If it says it on the label, and you're allergic to it, then you shouldn't eat it. This doesn't harm consumers at all.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#36

Post by starttoaster »

utensil4778 wrote: post #29
Molitor5901 wrote: post #15

This seems like splitting hairs on the part of the FDA. FDA officials acknowledged Tuesday that statements that a product “may contain” certain allergens “could be considered truthful and not misleading.” Bimbo officials have until July 8 to identify steps taken to remedy the issue — or to explain why the labeling doesn't violate FDA standards. So a baker.. who adds (insert allergy ingredient here), in minute quantit…

This is about sesame. Last year or so, the FDA changed the rules about sesame as an allergen. Some bakeries then decided to just slap "may contain traces of sesame" on everything so they didn't have to pay the cost of actually ensuring there's no cross-contamination. This has significantly harmed consumers who are actually allergic to sesame. Now there's effectively no way to know if a baked product will actually con…

> It was a clear and flagrant abuse of the "may contain traces" mechanism. The bakeries caused harm for consumers as a way to avoid the coats of doing business safely.

In the exact same way that every product ever invented may cause cancer in California, I assume? This is a problem with the FDA, not the companies. Give a dog a long leash, they're going to use the slack.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#37

Post by esd_g0d »

llamaimperative wrote: post #21
ganzuul wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's evil.

This is a really counterproductive way to try to understand problems like this. No one is trying to do anything evil. Every step is individually quite reasonable and well within ethical bounds. The issue is that you can produce systems comprised solely of reasonable and ethical decisions that nonetheless yield an outcome that every actor would describe as bad. That is a useful way to interpret this situation and othe…

This, a million times.

My dream is "game theory" taught in schools, so we can all more productively discuss public policy, etc.

The field of "mechanism design" may interest those to whom this speaks to. From Wiki (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanism_design):

> Mechanism design is a branch of economics, social choice theory, and game theory that deals with designing games (or mechanisms) to implement a given social choice function. Because it starts at the end of the game (the optimal result) and then works backwards to find a game that implements it, it is sometimes called reverse game theory.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#38

Post by ASalazarMX »

JohnMakin wrote: post #9
isaacfrond wrote: post #2

It's may favorite example of unintended consequences. FDA orders bakers to list allergens. There are stiff penalties if you are allergenic but don't list the allergen. So? Bakers claim their product contains allergens, even if they don't. FDA doesn't like it. So? Bakers add allergens on purpose, so they can rightly claim it contains them.

That is pretty funny, in a really sad way.

At least it gives more certainty than "might contain traces of ", which always leaves you wondering.

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#39

Post by JumpCrisscross »

gumby wrote: post #24

FWIW Bimbo (a Mexican company) is the largest baking company in north america -- when you go to the typical grocery store almost all the baked goods will be from Bimbo regardless of the label ( https://bimbobakeriesusa.com/our-brands )

Why are some of their brands just pictures of sandwiches?

Re: FDA warns top U.S. bakery not to claim foods contain allergens when they don't

#40

Post by hollerith »

utensil4778 wrote: post #29
Molitor5901 wrote: post #15

This seems like splitting hairs on the part of the FDA. FDA officials acknowledged Tuesday that statements that a product “may contain” certain allergens “could be considered truthful and not misleading.” Bimbo officials have until July 8 to identify steps taken to remedy the issue — or to explain why the labeling doesn't violate FDA standards. So a baker.. who adds (insert allergy ingredient here), in minute quantit…

This is about sesame. Last year or so, the FDA changed the rules about sesame as an allergen. Some bakeries then decided to just slap "may contain traces of sesame" on everything so they didn't have to pay the cost of actually ensuring there's no cross-contamination. This has significantly harmed consumers who are actually allergic to sesame. Now there's effectively no way to know if a baked product will actually con…

>Now there's effectively no way to know if a baked product will actually contain sesame

You are catastrophizing. It remains the case that any baked product that doesn't have "may contain traces of sesame" on the label must by law be free of traces of sesame. And if no producer chooses to produce such a product, then it is because the number of people who want it is quite small (or the costs of complying with regulations is too high to make a profit), and it is not hard for someone to bake their own bread.

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