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R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

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Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#71

Post by derleth »

winestock wrote: post #44
paulhauggis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was in school, I often wondered how often teachers did this.

I assume that the "hidden meaning" was supposed to be a moral for the edification of the children ( Think of the children! ). The idea that all stories must have a moral in order to be legitimate is modern. Conventional wisdom gets in a self-righteous huff over how the different Inquisitions censored books. It would surprise modern people to see what books those old-time moral guardians did not censor. Daphnis and Ch…

> the oldest extant novel

The Tale of Genji is now generally considered to hold that title.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tale_of_Genji

http://news.wustl.edu/news/Pages/11480.aspx

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#72

Post by ilamont »

Retric wrote: post #25
joshuahedlund wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Orson Scott Card is not too far off, IMO.

Sadly, I found over time his newer books became steadily worse. It's odd to me that someone like Jim Butcher can get steadily better where other authors 'give up', start believing their own hype, use ghost writers, or something.

Case in point: Frederick Pohl's Gateway series. The first book was amazing, the second was pretty solid, and then the series dropped off a cliff.

I wonder how much the economics of publishing and personal financial need figures into declining quality of (some) authors, musicians and other artists.

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#73

Post by ktizo »

TruthElixirX wrote: post #62
planetguy wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand you're not doing your students any favours if you let them only read the stuff they're interested in; or rather, the stuff they think they're interested in at the age of twelve. Gotta force them to broaden their horizons and read something else once in a while or they'll become... well, the kind of adults who only read science fiction.

>well, the kind of adults who only read science fiction. The horror.

The horror indeed, for what should we do when we see these dastardly creatures? Should we wave pitchforks, or just ring the church bells to warn others, while we cower inside and pray?

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#75

Post by winestock »

derleth wrote: post #71
winestock wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume that the "hidden meaning" was supposed to be a moral for the edification of the children ( Think of the children! ). The idea that all stories must have a moral in order to be legitimate is modern. Conventional wisdom gets in a self-righteous huff over how the different Inquisitions censored books. It would surprise modern people to see what books those old-time moral guardians did not censor. Daphnis and Ch…

> the oldest extant novel The Tale of Genji is now generally considered to hold that title. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tale_of_Genji http://news.wustl.edu/news/Pages/11480.aspx

I hope that this thread doesn't get derailed into nit-picking. The Tale of Genji was written in the eleventh century. The Golden Ass is a prose work which Apuleius wrote in the second century. Different authorities will have different definitions of the word "novel," so let's just agree to disagree.

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#76

Post by DanBC2 »

jedberg wrote: post #32

My favorite Ray Bradbury memory is the time he came to my school to talk about his books and ended up yelling at my English teach for trying to find hidden meaning that wasn't there just for the sake of busywork. RIP Mr. Bradbury.

You can go too far the other way. I know someone who, when asked why a character did something, would reply "Because that's what the author wrote?"

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#78

Post by D_Alex »

vannevar wrote: post #14

He was the last of the giants, along with Heinlein, Clark and Asimov. As a kid in the 70s, I devoured their novels and stories from the 50s and 60s. Bradbury was probably the most sophisticated writer of the four, though I preferred Asimov's straightforward, techie prose more back then. But we did get to read Bradbury in school, while none of the others was deemed lofty enough for the curriculum (except Heinlein's St…

There are new giants! Greg Egan, William Gibson, Charles Stross, Vernon Vinge - to name a few. Also, don't forget Larry Niven and Joe Haldeman, they are still around!

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#79

Post by ars »

wglb wrote: post #58
alanfalcon wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ray was a huge proponent of libraries. If you want to honor the man, go visit your local library today. Check out a book. Shame on you if you don't have a library card, but it's not too late to get one. If you have some money or some books you can donate, help the library out while you're there.

Every year, I take on the order of two boxes of books to the library nearest me that has an annual book sale. Profits from this book sale help that library.

I just return some books late. Not always on purpose..... :)

Re: R.I.P. Ray Bradbury, Author of Fahrenheit 451 and The Martian Chronicles

#80

Post by olavk »

winestock wrote: post #44
paulhauggis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was in school, I often wondered how often teachers did this.

I assume that the "hidden meaning" was supposed to be a moral for the edification of the children ( Think of the children! ). The idea that all stories must have a moral in order to be legitimate is modern. Conventional wisdom gets in a self-righteous huff over how the different Inquisitions censored books. It would surprise modern people to see what books those old-time moral guardians did not censor. Daphnis and Ch…

The Golden Ass very clearly have a moral or educational purpose. It also have plenty of hidden meaning in the sense that it is an allegory. But morals have changed over time, and being a pagan work, the moral is very different than in christian or modern works.
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