My disappointment for what this means for SerenityOS is pretty high.
Ladybird browser spreads its wings
181–190 of 319 posts
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#182I don't want to discourage the developers working on this project, but I'm curious why we're still writing applications that will almost certainly execute or process hostile content in languages that don't maintain strict memory safe contract? Have we not learned our lesson yet, or am I misunderstanding the situation? I believe it was a Microsoft study that linked unsafe memory access to ~70% of exploit chains.
[deleted]
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#183Earlier quoted context omitted.
For a new project I wonder how much simpler (or secure) a browser could be made if you only allowed a subset of js and browser apis. I’d wildly guesstimate for 70% of use cases you wouldn’t even need 50% of stuff with some slight modifications. The web is just so bloated. Edit: might as well prune down the css a little too and maybe dump wasm, webgl and canvas
This is so wildly wrong it hurts. As soon as that one important website (to your user) breaks, they will switch browsers. Just deciding that you don't want to implement >50% of web specs "for simplicity" and expecting that to be a winning strategy is very HN.
To me it’s not wrong at all, why won’t a simpler browser with a “modern mode” rendering succeds? There is no need for that browser to support the space jam website, who really cares? Imo thinking that people need quirks mode because they need to visit old website it’s very HN.
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#184Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't understand what is wrong with Firefox. It is open-source, highly configurable and reasonably secure (if you have the time to configure). Yes, it has shortcomings, but what doesn't.
Technically nothing; the problem lies entirely in the Mozilla Foundation which takes about $500B each year from Google. Officially the motivation is to keep Google as preferred search engine, but seriously the Firefox user base is so small that I don't even think Google would be interested for much less if there weren't strings attached that very likely create a huge conflict of interest if Mozilla become dependent o…
> $500B
I think you may have made a typo. Possibly $500M?
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#185Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't understand what is wrong with Firefox. It is open-source, highly configurable and reasonably secure (if you have the time to configure). Yes, it has shortcomings, but what doesn't.
Technically nothing; the problem lies entirely in the Mozilla Foundation which takes about $500B each year from Google. Officially the motivation is to keep Google as preferred search engine, but seriously the Firefox user base is so small that I don't even think Google would be interested for much less if there weren't strings attached that very likely create a huge conflict of interest if Mozilla become dependent o…
*million not billion
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#186I’m irrationally excited for this project. The idea of a community built browser is incredibly appealing considering the current landscape where all browsers are either Chrome, Chrome in a trench coat, or Firefox
[deleted]
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#187Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I don't understand what is wrong with Firefox. It's developed by Mozilla, Google's controlled opposition. I submitted a link[0] on ads coming to Firefox but HN shadowed it almost immediately (present on /newest when logged in, nowhere to be found when logged out). [0] https://www.jwz.org/blog/2024/06/mozilla-is-an-advertising-c...
That might be because Jamie Zawinski's website, which that link links to, does something ... special ... when it sees HN in the "Referer" field, so anyone actually following that link from here would (unless they take special measures) get IIRC a famous obscene image rather than the actual post you were hoping to link to. (JWZ is not a fan of Hacker News and its community.)
Ok, didn't knew that. Still a dick move on HN's part. Shadowing should be restricted to abusers.
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#188Why build another browser, from scratch, in C++?
Why aren't you building one in another language if that is something you feel is missing?
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#189Earlier quoted context omitted.
That’s a pretty cynical view. It’s more like asking why a car manufacturer is developing a car without modern safety mechanisms despite knowing those mechanisms save lives. If this is a work of art whose code is to be admired and only viewed as a creative work, fine I’m sorry I asked the question and that it was criticism of one’s vision. However, if this is something that is intended to be “driven” by other users in…
It's not cynical. It's how many of us feel when we read a comment like this. I believe you are right. But I also think that your phrasing is not very nice. It shows a lack of empathy and understanding and feels entitled. You could convey essentially the same message but be way nicer to everyone involved, and that would be way more efficient. If your ideal is a browser engine written in a safer language, and want to w…
I will attempt to word my questions/thoughts in a less confrontational way in the future. I tend to write my questions in the same way they occur in my internal monologue. I understand how that comes across to some.
I’m happy there is someone out there genuinely interested in creating another alternative to the near monoculture that is web browsers. I hope that they gain traction in the open source community as well as wider adoption upon maturity.
I’ll try to follow the project development and maybe I can learn myself why other languages may not be as well suited as C++. It seems that language proficiency is the most common answer I’ve received besides earned criticism of the way I formed my question.
Re: Ladybird browser spreads its wings
#190A related question: What's the state with Servo? Do I understand it correctly that Servo is the core of a browser but not the browser itself? How much work would it be to create a browser on top of Servo? And is there such a project?
They actually have an official blog with status updates!
They do have an official “browser”, ServoShell, which is basically a minimalistic testbed. IIRC adding tabs to it is on their roadmap.