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Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

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Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#61

Post by MBCook »

wrsh07 wrote: post #19
flakiness wrote: post #6

The author doesn't care about either the keyboard or the display because external parts are used... Maybe a mini PC is a better option for him?

I think this is right, but optionality is valuable. I'm curious if a $500 mini PC plus a bottomed out mb air would suffice (maybe not! Having all your stuff on your laptop can be useful) For all that, I haven't considered a Mac mini even though I'm probably an ideal user. It doesn't help that it's on the m2 instead of m3, though. (Or m4, which is in iPads?) I probably should

Yeah we’re kind of between. The M4 just appeared so it’s not there yet.

Rumor is the M3 chips were quite expensive due to the low yields on the new fab process so Apple didn’t seem to want to put them in their less popular computers/devices.

The M4 is on a different fab process. It’s the same feature size, but I don’t think it can run quite as fast. In exchange it’s much cheaper and cooler running. So an M4 sounds worth waiting for.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#62

Post by MBCook »

zamadatix wrote: post #60
MBCook wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without numbers/longer hands on impressions it’s hard to know. The Mac may have way faster storage. Or higher bandwidth RAM. Or run cooler. Or start faster. Or longer battery life. Or a better trackpad. Or keyboard. Or not. A lot of stuff in both machines is commodity parts. Apple doesn’t make its own screens and the Air is the worst screen their offer (I love it, but it’s relative). They don’t make storage chips or…

> They don’t make storage chips or RAM chips They use 3rd party NAND and DRAM but the controllers for each are part of their custom SoC (along with their CPU and GPU) and things are a little bit different than how anyone else does it with integrated solutions as a result. I believe the USB/thunderbolt are part of their custom SoC too. Some of the microcontrollers for other functionality (secure enclave, camera/microp…

That’s true. I wasn’t thinking of the custom controller, I forgot about it.

You’re right USB/TB interfaces are on the M3 (or whatever) directly.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#63

Post by ziml77 »

I have a Framework 16 and an 16" M1 MacBook Pro. The Framework 16 has just been a toy to mess around with on the side for me because the MacBook Pro is just so much better:

- The difference in battery life between the two is ridiculous. Even with a battery that's fairly degraded from all the charge cycles I've put it through, the MacBook still lasts 3-4 times as long under the same workloads - The quality of the touchpad experience is vastly better on the MacBook, especially because of the excellent haptics (like it's almost magical how much it feels like you're clicking a physical button despite there not being one) - The audio quality from the built in speakers is no contest between the two, the Framework simply sounds like crap - The fans of the Framework seem to be necessary far more often and are whinier sounding than the ones on the MacBook - The display on the Framework doesn't look as good, even when calibrated (I haven't been able to figure out if this is just due to me comparing matte vs glossy here though)

The Framework's repairability, modularity, and openness just aren't enough for me to overlook all the negatives. I love and support the goals of Framework and I hope they find ways to improve to the point where it will be easier to choose their laptops over a MacBook.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#64

Post by zamadatix »

spaceguillotine wrote: post #14

why do they always choose the Air and not a laptop that also has active cooling like the Framework. I want framework to succeed because i like the idea of modularity but c'mon, go against a MacBook Pro at least.

There's no good direct comparison that checks all the boxes of fairness while being something that makes much sense to order for the given products. If you go against a MacBook Pro to make the cooling type even then you've pretty much excluded comparing to any typical Framework build combo unless you're willing to compare to an absolutely anemic version of the Pro at a still likely higher cost. There will be some things each wins/loses on but, in the end, it doesn't make sense to get that version of the Pro anyways as the Pro really only starts to make balanced sense at the $2000 and up mark, right after where the Framework upgrades stop making sense.

One comparison that would involve the Pro is "best hardware I can buy regardless of the cost" but not many people ask that question and the answer is either going to be an obvious "a high end Pro" or "Framework because I need Linux and the M3 hardware isn't the best for that".

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#65

Post by zamadatix »

mertbio wrote: post #30

I can’t really see the detailed part of the review. You can simply open the web page of the both products and see the things mentioned in the blog post yourself.

Doing so will get you more accurate information too as e.g. the CPU in the Framework laptop is an 8 core CPU, not a 16 core.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#67

Post by mPReDiToR »

ericpauley wrote: post #2

> What I want to criticize is that Apple would rather re-add Magsafe than add another USB-C port, making one wonder if they are really clearing out old inventory. This is so minor, but clearly MagSafe isn’t about clearing out old inventory because it’s a different connector than old MagSafe.

Try this:

https://a.aliexpress.com/_EyK6Rjh

I use them in phones, laptops, Flipper Zero, anything which takes USB C.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#69

Post by jacknews »

cortesoft wrote: post #11
ericpauley wrote: post #2

> What I want to criticize is that Apple would rather re-add Magsafe than add another USB-C port, making one wonder if they are really clearing out old inventory. This is so minor, but clearly MagSafe isn’t about clearing out old inventory because it’s a different connector than old MagSafe.

Also, MagSafe is way better for charging than USB-C, since you can’t damage it if the cable is pulled.

Do the new magsafe pins burn out after a year or two like the old ones? Or the cable insulation sloughs off? And then of course you had to buy an entire new proprietary charger from Apple, not just a 3rd party cable. Or even take the laptop to Apple to replace the laptop's magsafe connector.

Re: Comparing the Framework Laptop with the MacBook Air M2: A Detailed Review

#70

Post by [deleted] »

MBCook wrote: post #49
linguae wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also have a Framework 13, and I agree that Apple’s ARM laptops have amazing performance per watt. The reason I have a Framework 13 instead of an ARM Mac is user-serviceability and cost savings. There is 32GB of RAM in my Framework, and at any time I could choose to upgrade to 64GB whenever necessary. However, because RAM in ARM Macs is integrated into the system and is not a separate user-replaceable component, I m…

I’m firmly in team Mac. And I really don’t care about upgradability that much. I’m OK with buying up front. But Apple’s BTO prices are, as everyone knows, totally insane. Combined with pathetic base amounts it really burns people. I know a lot of Mac fans who keep putting off upgrades because it costs so much to get a decent config.

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