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Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

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Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#111
post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it? This is literally the first time Ive seen the word human applied to other hominids. I see many discussions about neanderthals and denisovians and so on. I have never seen them referred to as human.

I think it’s not uncommon to refer to Neanderthals as early humans, I’m sure I’ve read that in many places. Natural history museum, for example, refers to them as early humans: https://www.nhm.ac.uk/discover/who-were-the-neanderthals.htm...

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Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#112
post #72

It’s fascinating to think about the number of PUs (procedural units) it takes to make a modern tool. Something as simple as a modern hammer must number in the thousands and a mobile phone in the millions or billions.

You might find the essay "I, Pencil" by Leonard Read interesting. It's told from the point of view of a pencil who talks about the complexity of his own creation and all of the components involved in the process

It's just ideological drivel. People never had any difficulty to cooperate on such level.

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#113
post #86
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Billions of transistors in a smart phone, and those took many^many machines to build

the genius of photolithography (and its descendents) is that each chip is printed all at once, all the transistors at once over several steps for the several layers. This is what makes chips inexpensive.

The genius of photolithography is many things, I wouldn't say the wafer process is any more special than the statistical models that can predict where a nozzle needs to point to lay substract with more precision than the nozzle itself can provide or a number of other important inventions there.

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#114
post #40

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I'm highly suspicious that the whole "inner vs no-inner monologue" thing doesn't actually exist and has more to do with these things being extremely hard to explain using language, and people describing their subjective experience in subtly different ways.

I 100% do not think in words or sentences or language. It feels more like node-traversing a graph of concepts, but it's all completely abstract. While I am able to consciously play back my thoughts linguistically or visually with some effort (and at the cost of efficiency), by default there are neither words nor images. French is my first language, I'm fluent in English, and I know a bit about many languages... But I…

Right, very like me. Language is the front end; I use it to express thoughts when needed (to record, communicate and check reasoning) The back end is working in some kind of abstract space.

I suspect people who say they think in language are not really thinking "in" language. I think we all have this abstract conceptual space in us. I'm not even sure what it means to think in language; where do the ideas and concepts come from that are being expressed? I guess some people have to internally "hear" a thought expressed before it is real to them.

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where does "clearly" originate, and what does it refer to? Is "just" a synonym for "exactly" in this context?

"Clearly" refers to the obviousness or self-evidence of the statement. In this context, "just" means "similarly" or "in the same way," or ig "exactly" if you like. "Clearly" because exterior stimuli clearly influence both thinking and feeling, a concept supported by common experience and scientific understanding of human cognition and emotions.

Influence != Determine

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The word human is commonly used for both modern humans and members of the entire genus Homo. Hominids is a more general superset that isn't strictly correct here. The term hominin is more appropriate in this context and what they actually use in the abstract. In my opinion though, "human" is the better word here for conveying the right mix of informality without implying the specific semantics of "Hominini sans Pan".

Is it? This is literally the first time Ive seen the word human applied to other hominids. I see many discussions about neanderthals and denisovians and so on. I have never seen them referred to as human.

I'm not sure where you are reading but both layman and scientists commonly use the word "human" to refer to the genus "homo". To look at just one example, Ian Tattersall called one of his books "Extinct Humans" and it is a look at the history of the genus homo:

https://www.amazon.com/Extinct-Humans-Ian-Tattersall/dp/0813...

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#117
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Record keeping doesn't need writing. Like Incas with their knotted ropes (probably not how how you call it in English). Also, while some central Asians could read and write (they had courrier relay to deliver letters), their administrative/taxing/military system, the decimal system, worked without any writing for two thousand years, only by making a mark on a wooden branch for each person in an Arban, a mark on anoth…

What's amusing of course is that the word text shares a root with textiles and hence the notion of weaving thread or cloth. I'd strongly suggest not getting bogged down in the details of what various forms of notional recording are --- ink on paper, etching on stone, holes punched in paper, magnetic field alignments in rust (spinning, sequential, or otherwise), bitfields in memory arrays, holographic images ... Recor…

You managed to explain my own thoughts to me, thank you.

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#118
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slightly unrelated, but James Burke explains this really well in Connections[1] S01E03. Basically he says one of the reasons China didn't experience the rapid growth Europe went through during the Renaissance was because Chinese society during those times had a strict hierarchy. You weren't allowed to rise through the ranks with your inventions or technologies, no matter how revolutionary they were. "No incentive, no…

Was the Renaissance driven by concerns of social mobility? Galileo's telescope was not calculated to improve his rank in society.

It certainly was, and initially did improve his reputation.

If you look at what happened he could have benefited hugely if he was not obnoxious and had not gone out of his was to annoy people. He mocked the powerful, and he insisted that the Copernican cosmology (the sun is the centre of the universe) was not just a theory, but had been proven true.

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#119
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That idea is pretty similar to "assembly theory" no? In the sense of how much information or evolution was necessary to generate some artifact, be it a benzene molecule, a stone tool, or an iphone

It took humans 300k years, all of us, our collective output to reach this point. Yet people insist on comparing a human who is part of society with a LLM alone, who doesn't even have search, and very limited contexts, just closed book mode remembering.

You seem to be hallucinating a strawman

Re: Humans began to rapidly accumulate technological knowledge 600k years ago

#120

More recent history seems to paint another picture - knowledge is quickly gained as cognitive ability increases, and is even more rapidly lost once it diminishes. Think of not only the replication crisis in science, but also the despair to retain "tacit knowledge" the failure of which often results in outright abandonment and outsourcing to somewhere else. The technology to land on the Moon seems to be effectively lo…

>>> The technology to land on the Moon seems to be effectively lost. The technology might be, but not the knowledge. The tech just became obsolete and probably not up to safety standards anyway. I doubt we'd have much trouble recreating a better equivalent if the incentives existed.

We couldn't. It was just a well known example. Writing doesn't help much - the words lose their meaning without people capable of acquiring the knowledge before hand. Whatever you preserve is worthless without the mountain of implicit knowledge that can only be acquired, and not taught. Knowledge is being lost even as elderly workers try to pass their knowledge to new hires with zero success.
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