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EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

patrick-breyer.de

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Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#21

Post by shortsunblack »

lxgr wrote: post #11
belter wrote: post #7

EU is, and always was, a compensation job for failed national politicians at their respective national levels. It's the trade horse for allowing your party buddies to take over the government jobs. EU politicians should keep their over inflated salaries, and stick to what they are good at. Meeting with Google and Microsoft lobbyists at the best Brussels luxury restaurants.

> Meeting with Google and Microsoft lobbyists at the best Brussels luxury restaurants. Are you talking about the same EU that just passed the DMA? That must have been some really nasty food poisoning then!

DMA, like any other regulation that preceded it, was severely lobbied down. It happened in spite of EU. There is too great of a democratic consensus for it to be completely ignored. Do not get this wrong.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#22

Post by cjbgkagh »

FredPret wrote: post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

Free speech absolutists like myself got run over culturally with hate speech laws so for anyone continuing on the fight I wish you the best of luck.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#23

Post by matricaria »

lxgr wrote: post #11
belter wrote: post #7

EU is, and always was, a compensation job for failed national politicians at their respective national levels. It's the trade horse for allowing your party buddies to take over the government jobs. EU politicians should keep their over inflated salaries, and stick to what they are good at. Meeting with Google and Microsoft lobbyists at the best Brussels luxury restaurants.

> Meeting with Google and Microsoft lobbyists at the best Brussels luxury restaurants. Are you talking about the same EU that just passed the DMA? That must have been some really nasty food poisoning then!

Are they even enforcing DMA? My WhatsApp still doesn’t have Third Party Chats.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#25

Post by ang_cire »

delichon wrote: post #12
FredPret wrote: post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

> This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed ... We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal The entities that need to be circumscribed need to enforce a law that circumscribes themselves? Those incentives do not seem to align to form a stable structure.

That's why you need to always ensure authority rests with individuals, or the ability to secure against unjust authority.

The second your only recourse against authority is to politely ask it not to do something bad to you (maybe, for instance, on a piece of paper with multiple choice questions), you have no real autonomy.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#26

Post by londons_explore »

linuxandrew wrote: post #3

Signal Foundation has already said they would leave the EU if Chat Control goes ahead. https://mastodon.world/@Mer__edith/112535616774247450

Signal isn't big enough to play that game.

They'll just be blocked from the app store for EU users and their user base in the EU will drop to near zero within a year.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#27

Post by moffkalast »

> Only Germany, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Austria and Poland are relatively clear that they will not support the proposal, but this is not sufficient for a “blocking minority”.

Ahem what? Last I checked any EU country can veto anything on its own.

> Belgian EU Council presidency

It's Council of the EU, not EU Council, that's the heads of state who don't have any legislative role. But the Council only does inter-country treaties, how is this even their thing?

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#28

Post by FredPret »

cjbgkagh wrote: post #22
FredPret wrote: post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

Free speech absolutists like myself got run over culturally with hate speech laws so for anyone continuing on the fight I wish you the best of luck.

We learnt the value of free speech the hard way, and very slowly. Now we need to keep extending such notions to the rapidly increasing frontiers that new tech is exposing.

Hopefully with more tech-savvy generations gradually taking power, this will happen without too many painful lessons.

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#29

Post by Wytwwww »

FredPret wrote: post #18
delichon wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed ... We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal The entities that need to be circumscribed need to enforce a law that circumscribes themselves? Those incentives do not seem to align to form a stable structure.

The only way is to have a broad-based idea among the people about exactly what is allowed for a government and a big business. There's a strong and widespread expectation among many that it's morally imperative for them to be able to elect their own government. So any moves by the government to limit this will be met by fierce resistance. If a similar idea existed about privacy, these sneaky moves wouldn't be feasibl…

> widespread expectation among many that it's morally imperative for them to be able to elect their own government. So any moves by the government to limit this will be met by fierce resistance.

That's not really true as far as it comes to the EU though? The EU parliament has always been a joke with limited power (both because of structural reasons and because most of it's members are clueless and extremely easy to influence) and besides that the EU population has no way to exert any direct influence on EU policies (they could do that through the council but they'd have prioritize the EU over domestic issues when voting in national elections which will never happen)

Re: EU to greenlight Chat Control tomorrow

#30

Post by ziggy_star »

FredPret wrote: post #4

This is why the roles of the major players in society (government, monopolies) need to be circumscribed. Large organizations will always try to grow in size and power. We need some sort of human right for digital privacy to make this sort of thing illegal.

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