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DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

dronedj.com

161–170 of 742 posts

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#161

Who decided it is a good idea to pass brands / companies specific bills? If DJI is doing nasty things, prohibit the nasty things DJI doing in the law, not the brand. Then condemn DJI if needed. How do this law protect from any DJi competitor doing the same stuff (or even a spinoff company through a complex scheme)?

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Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#162
It's interesting to see how the reactions differ between here and the articles on the ban on TikTok. And some even thought that the users who wrote to their government representatives were bots! Whenever the US bans or sanctions something, that impacts people, whether it's drone nerds or teens looking at silly videos. It just so happens that most people here seem to be outside of the TikTok target demographic, so we can't sympathize with a group that will be forcefully deprived of a perfectly functional product, but we can with the other.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#163
post #66
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Single-use means $20K - $50K, not $2K. What militaries are competing against with the Houthis and in Ukraine, is 20 - 50K drones and right now taking them down with $2MM missiles or a 50K drone taking out a 2MM tank. Dial those numbers up and you can see how the imbalance in cost is unsustainable. They don't need drones to be 2K.

I think the military perspective at this point is that they want drones at all price points. Those 20-50k drones, I assume you mean like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZALA_Lancet and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HESA_Shahed_136 ? The cost estimates for those are quite wide, but in terms of raw materials even those low-cost prices are kind of absurd right? $20,000 for a few motors, batteries, basically a modern smart…

I don't understand why every estimate assumes Russian and Iranian engineers work for free and only include the raw material/components cost of these weapons systems.

R&D costs makes up the vast majority of the cost of Western weapons systems.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GDPR is really sensible legislation that largely only applies to companies who should be treating your personal data as sensitive data. I built a GDPR complaint system and was really happy about the security we put in place that we definitely wouldn’t have thought to do without these laws. Things like having someone you can ask and request personal data from at big companies is also an extremely well thought through…

Most people have no problem with the GDPR. It only seems otherwise on this forum and similar echo chambers / bubbles where lots of people made their fortunes with adtech.

I love the intention of the law, but it's so... flexible... in implementation that shitty implementers ended up making the browsing experience horrible with intrusive pop-ups and geo blocking.

On mobile every page load ends up with me spending the first minute or so on page dealing with the half-screen "don't sell my info" cookie dance, followed with the ad-block pop-ups.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is banning DJI drones in the US going to affect how they're being used in the war in Ukraine? It will not. > Or do you mean that banning them in the US will somehow stop them from being used against the US in the future? No. This is about planning for the future. In the event of a war the US wants a large existing base of domestic drone manufacturers. Today, that just does not exist at scale as most are made in…

> This is about planning for the future. In the event of a war the US wants a large existing base of domestic drone manufacturers. Today, that just does not exist at scale as most are made in China. This is similar to efforts to re-shore chip manufacturing. I don't think the US military generally uses off-the-shelf consumer products like the Ukraine military does, so does this actually affect them? They would be gett…

"I don't think the US military generally uses off-the-shelf consumer products like the Ukraine military does, so does this actually affect them?"

Yes, because if you have no drone manufacturing in your country, you can't just spin on a dime and suddenly have military-grade drone manufacturing. Technology is a lot less about knowing what the atomic weight of cesium is and a lot more about employee A knowing that B knows how to solve instability problems and their contact at company C knows what to do when the blades spin apart. You can't build the massive networks of those relationship by just passing a law today and expecting to have a best-of-class industry tomorrow, no matter how much money you throw at it.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#166

This is so misguided it's breathtaking. Even if one buys into the supposed "harm" it's apparently trying to address, by targeting a specific corporate entity the proposed legislation won't do anything meaningful toward those ends. But it will confuse the market and hurt U.S. hobbyist consumers while being largely unenforceable anyway. It's one of those things that's just so dumb you assume it's only congressional ele…

Since corporations are people (in the minds of US jurists) wouldn't that make it an unconstitutional Bill of Attainder?

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#167
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the cheaper 3D printers are mostly chinese, Prusa is still a non-chinese option :)

While this is true and I own a Prusa MK4, they're so behind it's not even funny.

While Bamboo etc are one head in front of Prusa now, they are still very close in the context of printing weapons. I mean, neither are particularly suited compared to a CNC mill or lathe. And both have come quite a long way since what we had 10-15 years ago, when FDM for non-industrial users got started.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#168
post #73

For people wonder how this got there, the blame goes to Rep. Elise Stefanik: https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/2864 That bill was tacked onto a big "must pass" defense authorization and may not have survived on its own. Here's an article with some speculation on why Stefanik introduced this bill: https://dronexl.co/2024/06/06/drone-industry-outrage-stefani...

And if you need a backgrounder on Stefanik, she got elected before Trump, decided she preferred staying in DC to her hometown, sold out her previously-stated principles almost immediately when she saw a chance to gain power, and is now doing as much damage to civil liberties as Nixon and McCarthy ever managed: https://theracket.news/p/stop-going-stefanik-committee-fools She doesn't care about whether the bill does so…

I'll add more as a NY21 local:

I've never seen her. I've never heard from her locally. You can't fucking find Elise. It's all events in the past. There's never been a townhall up in this portion of her region.

Bonus: Her husband is a lobbyist for a leading gun industry trade group. https://www.timesunion.com/news/article/Stefanik-s-husband-K...

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is banning DJI drones in the US going to affect how they're being used in the war in Ukraine? It will not. > Or do you mean that banning them in the US will somehow stop them from being used against the US in the future? No. This is about planning for the future. In the event of a war the US wants a large existing base of domestic drone manufacturers. Today, that just does not exist at scale as most are made in…

> This is about planning for the future. In the event of a war the US wants a large existing base of domestic drone manufacturers. Today, that just does not exist at scale as most are made in China. This is similar to efforts to re-shore chip manufacturing. I don't think the US military generally uses off-the-shelf consumer products like the Ukraine military does, so does this actually affect them? They would be gett…

>I don't think the US military generally uses off-the-shelf consumer products like the Ukraine military does, so does this actually affect them? They would be getting drones built to order from a military contractor anyway, so I don't think it really matters what the leading consumer manufacturer of drones is to the US military from that perspective.

They rather famously switched to an Xbox controller for their rolling drones, and for their submarine controls, because they just work better. For quite a while, military-issued camelbaks still had bright blue caps because the contract to custom build the systems hadn't been settled yet. There are in fact plenty of electronics that they use that are not purpose built, that are bought more or less off the shelf.

All of that said, I still agree that the US military is unlikely to allow off-the-shelf drones at this time. Parts availability is the driver there. Its better to pay a contractor $3k a pop to buy a bunch of a DJI Mavics, spray paint them olive drab, and issue them to each platoon than it is to give every platoon $3k and say "go buy a drone", because then you can buy 6000 of the same replacement rotor or whatever.

Re: DJI ban passes the House and moves on to the Senate

#170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be thankful that consumer/hobbyist drones haven't been banned entirely already (banning other model aircraft along with them as collateral damage). Especially after all the footage of essentially-hobby-grade drones with familiar open-source flight controller software being turned into very effective weapons of war in Ukraine.

The bans are inevitable. It's only a matter of time before somebody tries to drop a pipe bomb on a politician.

I hope not, i'm pretty involved in the high power rocketry hobby and the materials/electronics and knowledge exist in the hobby to make something like a guided surface-to-surface rocket with a range in 10s of miles but no one does because it would instantly ruin the hobby for everyone. A friend of mine in heavy into r/c planes and is an embedded engineer so he has a bunch of autopilot stuff going on. I'm sure he can scale as high as he wants (he's also a private pilot) and fly a heavy payload to a point on a map autonomously. Again, no one does it because it would ruin the hobby for everyone.

Lots of people want to do this but the place for it is like a DARPA challenge not in the general hobby. If the authorities got wind of it then down come the regulations and no more hobby.

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