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Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

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Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#11
I don't like false dichotomies like this. Why can't kids learn to do both well? Standardized tests are akin to FizzBuzz for college entrance. If you can't get 500/800 in the Math SATs, you will not be able to keep up in STEM majors with others who scored 700+.

Given the real constraint of limited resources, you have to implement barriers to entry. Standardized tests are not perfect but they serve well. Of course, making rockets and robots is awesome so everyone should be encouraged to explore that.

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#13
'We walked into an empty room that once was the metal shop. It was perfect. I could imagine it having tools and materials and workbenches. I could imagine groups of curious kids being active, social, and mobile. '

When I was in 6th grade, they let us use a spot welder and press brake. I still have the box I made out of folded sheet metal from that time. We also had to make a little container out of folded sheet metal that surrounded an egg. The metal shop teacher piled weights on everyone's in the class until the eggs broke.

In 8th grade (2001), they let us use MIG welders and the project was to make a crane with the maximum cantilever given a set of counterweights and a limited amount of 1/8"x1" steel. I remember the entire class standing around watching as we piled weights up until they failed spectactulary.

It's not a coincidence that those are some of my (few) vivid memories of middle school. I remember being bored in a lot of classes that simply weren't challenging enough, but never in metal shop or science class.

They don't even have metal or wood shop in the middle school anymore. They barely have it in the high school. It's probably some combination of safety and budget, but can anyone imagine the school allowing basically 13 year olds to handle MIG welders anymore? It gets hot! Or sheet metal in 11 year olds hands? It's sharp!

By high school all of the best and brightest are maxing out AP classes for college applications. There is no time left for 'fun' classes like metal shop if you aren't going to trade school. (That becomes quite apparent when you get to college and there are mechanical engineer majors who can't work a hand drill.)

If we lose all of this stuff, we are going to lose the next generation of engineers. FIRST robotics is a great program, but we need more things like it.

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#16
I'm opposed to standardized tests more than most people, however I have to take issue with this article. The author of this article stated early on that this was a 'reading comprehension question', and then goes onto to critique the question as if it was about learning about microscopes. He also says that he 'couldn't figure it out' by guessing. He should've tried reading.

As an aside, I did know the correct answer because I had been trained numerous times on microscope use. I didn't even look at the question until after reading the rest of the article. The test makers wouldn't have been testing my reading comprehension. I suspect this would be true of most people who got the correct answer. Interestingly, anyone who has been trained in taking such tests knows to read the answers first, as well as to guess the correct one. Then scan the actual question to find the relevant bit, as well as the 'trick', if it exists.

Like many people, I believe this author confuses learning with being a student. A student's job is to be a student, and that includes trying to score higher than average on tests by any legal means. Learning is something else altogether, and I have my doubts about being able to get far with that in an institutionalized setting.

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#17
By 4 poking speakers with pencils, by 7 burning raw sulphur to investigate the blue flame & burning holes in test tubes, by 8 taking photos of bugs & crystals down microscopes, by 9 re-wiring light switches into 240 volts, by 10 hacking electric motors with propellers, by 12 building & flying balloons & model aircraft & programming.

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#18
post #7
post #4

I remember taking a standardized test in public elementary school in the US (I think this was the Iowa series). At the end of one section I finished early, I counted the number of questions and was planning on finding out some basic stats on the questions. We hear "pencils down", and so the break period comes around. I comply, and the teacher collects our tests. I then picked up my pencil again and started doing a bu…

Reminds me of my primary school's request to my parents that they stop me from having access to books at home as it was making me difficult to teach.

Upvoted a thousand percent. This sums up everything that is wrong with education.

(EDIT: spellchecking my dumb arse)

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#19
Sigh. You need both. The reality is that there's a lot of book-learning in the world. You're never going to build a rocket to the moon by starting in your backyard with some sheet metal - your lifespan isn't long enough if you take that approach. You have to read books written by people who have gone before, and learn from their mistakes, which you can do at a far more rapid pace than you can by making all those mistakes yourself. Only by standing on the shoulders of those who have gone before - that is, by reading their books - can you hope to push boundaries.

The writer's complaint is daft. The purpose is to test if you can read a passage and comprehend it. Has nothing to do with microscopes. Has nothing to do with "teaching science", as the writer asserts. Just because he doesn't understand the purpose of the test doesn't mean there isn't one. Reading and comprehending text is one of life's fundamental skills. It is, in fact, useful to know if schools are teaching that well or not.

Before I get downvoted into oblivion I should say I also think schools should do hands-on work (which, of course, they do).

Re: Kids should be building rockets and robots, not taking standardized tests

#20
post #11

I don't like false dichotomies like this. Why can't kids learn to do both well? Standardized tests are akin to FizzBuzz for college entrance. If you can't get 500/800 in the Math SATs, you will not be able to keep up in STEM majors with others who scored 700+. Given the real constraint of limited resources, you have to implement barriers to entry. Standardized tests are not perfect but they serve well. Of course, mak…

Agreed! The situation is similar to professional organizations like ACM and IEEE who act as gatekeeper and moneymaker for academic journals, which make people angry (justifiably so). It's a bad solution, but you need some form of reputation management. You can't have kids who want to enroll to MIT line up in a stadium and have them build metal boxes, or write code. However, you can use these as additional input to the standardized test scores.

Articles like this continuously bicker about standardized tests but don't realize how much better the situation is compared with other countries, like China, India, Japan, etc. There nothing else matters other than your score, here at least they look at your application essay, your extracurricular activities and such.

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