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Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

electrek.co

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Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#21

Post by blueflow »

toenail wrote: post #3
leononame wrote: post #2

It's not too surprising. Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech, but they are a car manufacturing powerhouse and are the biggest country in Europe. The whole country is in an everlasting debate about its dependency on car manufacturing, and cars are _very_ important. It would be surprising if they weren't no 1 producer (and probably consumer) in Europe.

> and are the biggest country in Europe Err, what? #6 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...

Economy does not come from the geographical size, it comes from the people inhabitating it.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#22

Post by mytailorisrich »

lispm wrote: post #14
leononame wrote: post #2

It's not too surprising. Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech, but they are a car manufacturing powerhouse and are the biggest country in Europe. The whole country is in an everlasting debate about its dependency on car manufacturing, and cars are _very_ important. It would be surprising if they weren't no 1 producer (and probably consumer) in Europe.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

Electricity generation is still 25% coal. Germany's emissions per capita are very high compared to, say, France, because their electricity production is still actually very dirty. France's electricity production has been very low-emissions for decades because of nuclear and hydro.

There's a lot of spin about renewables in Germany but overall this is a failed energy policy.

(Edited)

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#24

Post by leononame »

toenail wrote: post #17
leononame wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where I'm from, when you say "biggest" country, it's by default population unless specified otherwise. Area really isn't an important metric here (unless your country is tiny), because the ability of economic and industrial output scales with population more than with area. The most logical comparison would be by GDP here, because we're comparing economy. But for population, which is what I think about when specifyin…

Thanks, fwiw, Russia is still #1 by population if you only count population in Europe.

That's definitely fair. I just blurped it out that way because, at least in my experience, Russia isn't really considered a European country "colloquially". At least where I'm from, people would usually say it's Asian when asked what continent Russia belongs to (if they had to pick one).

But I agree it doesn't really hold up to more detailed scrutiny.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#25

Post by lispm »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #22
lispm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

Electricity generation is still 25% coal. Germany's emissions per capita are very high compared to, say, France, because their electricity production is still actually very dirty. France's electricity production has been very low-emissions for decades because of nuclear and hydro. There's a lot of spin about renewables in Germany but overall this is a failed energy policy. (Edited)

23% coal, 28.2% less than last year.

Renewable energy is hugely increasing world wide.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#26

Post by oblio »

lispm wrote: post #14
leononame wrote: post #2

It's not too surprising. Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech, but they are a car manufacturing powerhouse and are the biggest country in Europe. The whole country is in an everlasting debate about its dependency on car manufacturing, and cars are _very_ important. It would be surprising if they weren't no 1 producer (and probably consumer) in Europe.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

Germany FUBARed this like you wouldn't believe, those responsible will probably be branded traitors decades after the fact, primarily Schroeder (now a Gazprom shill) but probably also Merkel for not doing anything to change the status quo.

Up until 2011 or so Germany was a leader in solar and wind power equipment production. Then they cut off subsidies and it took AN ENTIRE DECADE to get back where they were, in terms of adding additional capacity, by which point China absolutely towered over everyone else.

Europe has also missed the battery production train.

Oil and gas are considered geostrategic priorities and almost every country tried to secure its supply. Solar and wind power equipment production as well as battery production, for some reason, were treated as second class citizens in a world where they will replace oil and gas for 80% of uses.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#27

Post by oblio »

leononame wrote: post #24
toenail wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, fwiw, Russia is still #1 by population if you only count population in Europe.

That's definitely fair. I just blurped it out that way because, at least in my experience, Russia isn't really considered a European country "colloquially". At least where I'm from, people would usually say it's Asian when asked what continent Russia belongs to (if they had to pick one). But I agree it doesn't really hold up to more detailed scrutiny.

> At least where I'm from, people would usually say it's Asian when asked what continent Russia belongs to (if they had to pick one).

Heh, that's quite funny, where are you from? :-)

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#28

Post by lispm »

leononame wrote: post #19
lispm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

Sure, renewable _electricity_ is up. But up alone is not enough. When talking energy, you should use gross energy, including e.g. transport. Take this chart [0] from wikipedia [1]. Doesn't look too amazing. Now, being a gross exporter, the numbers are obviously skewed, but I didn't really mean EVs or electrical production specifically. German bureaucracy famously still runs on fax and emails are printed, there are lo…

I live in Germany and I can't even remember where and when I have seen a fax.

I was flying back from munich to hamburg last week, with a passenger jet, which is produced in my hometown, with internet in the plane - not a fax.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#29

Post by somedude895 »

lispm wrote: post #14
leononame wrote: post #2

It's not too surprising. Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech, but they are a car manufacturing powerhouse and are the biggest country in Europe. The whole country is in an everlasting debate about its dependency on car manufacturing, and cars are _very_ important. It would be surprising if they weren't no 1 producer (and probably consumer) in Europe.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

This is what happens when you shut down nuclear (which is carbon-neutral by the way), and start importing more. Total energy usage in Germany is down which is terrible news for your economy. The narrative that German energy policy under the current government has been anything but a failure is ridiculous, but some people just love to believe any garbage that comes out of Habeck's mouth.

Re: Germany is No 1 in Europe for EV production, No 2 in the world

#30

Post by madspindel »

oblio wrote: post #26
lispm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, Germany is slow to adapt to new tech Like renewable energy? 1st quarter 2024: 58,4% electricity from renewable energy. Up from 48.5% last year.

Germany FUBARed this like you wouldn't believe, those responsible will probably be branded traitors decades after the fact, primarily Schroeder (now a Gazprom shill) but probably also Merkel for not doing anything to change the status quo. Up until 2011 or so Germany was a leader in solar and wind power equipment production. Then they cut off subsidies and it took AN ENTIRE DECADE to get back where they were, in term…

And they are sabotaging the power production in Sweden too:

"Germany begs for electricity from Sweden – while simultaneously blocking nuclear power"

https://www.tn.se/naringsliv/37243/tyskland-tigger-el-fran-s...

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