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Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

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Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#881

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Commit less atrocities" in this case is just code for permitting others to commit whatever atrocities they want. American "atrocities" against Japan pale I comparison to what the Japanese were inflicting on the rest of Asia.

It's not a code. It's literally saying leave doing bad things to bad guys. Instead just becoming one of them but being proud about it because your atrocities were somehow better because the cause justifies the means and your cause is just. By that logic jihad is fine. Have you noticed how in history good guys always eventually won every major conflict? What are the odds? 100% if you paint a bullseye after you shot.

The good guys dropped nuclear bombs on 200k+ civilian men, women, and children. There was literally no other option. USA #1.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#882

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That flap is already a legend, kept at it even mangled by hot plasma, crazy accelerations and pressures, spitting molten steel at the camera. What a role model, the little flap that could.

Someone on the Everyday Astronaut live stream named it "Flap Norris".

Absolutely genius! Go Chuck :)

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#883

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their older fairing reentry plasma also looked really cool https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ke_QI7_UtA8

Does the fairing have attitude control thrusters used during descent, or is its orientation maintained passively due to its shape?

I believe the fairings experienced uncontrolled freefall

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#884
post #717

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Here, have a look at required deltaV. https://www.reddit.com/r/space/comments/1ktjfi/deltav_map_of ... > how is this 'From an energy perspective its not that much more complex.'? According to that chart: Moon landing ∆V: 9.4+2.44+0.68+0.14+0.68+1.73 = 15.1 km/s Mars landing ∆V: 9.4+2.44+0.68+0.09+0.39+0.67+.034+0.40+0.70+3.8 = 18.6 km/s

And the Mars one actually overstates it because you can use backbreaking to reduce that further. So in actual reality with Starships design they are quite close. I guess ChatGPT is pretty good.

> I guess ChatGPT is pretty good.

Just because you listened to podcast doesn't mean you know what you are talking about. Cuz your arguments are clearly all hype a surface knowledge.

The biggest chunk of deltaV there is the LEO

Removing it makes trip to mars 160% more expensive. And "Areobreaking" is already counted in the trip to mars.

You also conveniently forget about the fact that mars spaceship will be much heavier. And while deltaV doesn't change the amount of fuel to achieve it does. Significantly.

Not to mention the 8.5 months transfer will have damaging effect on the body. We already did a study on impact of prolonged space stay. Whats the impact on humans living in 3.7m/s2 ?? How would fetus develop in such environment.

But lets sweep this under the rag, it will be solved soon (tm)

Its very convenient to overlook actual small details that dont fit a narrative. But in space Yes-man run out of air really quickly.

I am done with this thread as you are just stubborn kid parroting same old bs hype people produce to justify their existence.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#885

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am reading this and I can't believe it. Was this written by chatgtp? > From an energy perspective its not that much more complex. As in what exactly? Its not much more complex because you have to 'burn to moon' and 'burn to mars' which is pretty much the same because you need energy to do both?? Here, have a look at required deltaV. https://www.reddit.com/r/space/comments/1ktjfi/deltav_map_of... how is this 'From a…

If you don't understand my comment on the energy perspective you shouldn't comment on the topic. > What ship?!? Labs, medical facilities wtf r u smoking. The Starship. SpaceX is currently building an interior for the Moon Lander together with NASA that will have those things. For a small crew its totally possible to have this. Not sure what to tell you. > And why dont you mention how many fueling launches you need to…

wow. ok keep on reading marketing pamphlets. I am done with you. Now you are either outright lying or are ignorant to the point where you actually believe any bs musk says.

I mean, I ask you a question and you straight up talk about something else... what else is there to say... you are like a politician on tv. Talks, talks, talks but doesn't say anything.

Its pointless arguing with parrot.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#886

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The German strategy was to pressure the British civilians into pressuring their government for an end to hostilities against Germany. They were demoralizing the British, and to that end the weapon was actually effective though the government did not capitulate. Additionally, reports of damage to the British capital city was very morale-raising for the Germans who saw mostly the destruction of their own cities. That a…

> though the government did not capitulate. Weirdly, that's how it almost always works out. Didn't work in England, didn't work in Germany, not working in Ukraine. Kinda makes that "though" look silly in retrospect. That's why today we consider bombing civilians to have no military utility.

Yet you ignore some very well known successful recent bombing campaigns:

- NATO in Libya in 2011

- Operation Iraqi Freedom

- Operation Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan)

- US and coalition campaign against ISIS

- Saudi bombing in Yemen have pretty much stalled the Houthis.

- Russia in Syria for the last decade

- France in the Sahel

- The Turks in Iraq and Syria, been going on for almost a decade.

- Israel against Hezbollah in summer of 2006, didn't get the captured soldiers back but did stall the rockets against Northern Israel. And in Gaza in 2014, similar result in stopping the rocket attacks.

- Kosovo in 1999

That's all off the top of my head, though I did have to Google the names a bit. And it's all within recent memory, I remember every one of those conflicts. I'm sure some old timers here will mention quite a few more, spanning further back in time and further geographically.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#887

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the Mars one actually overstates it because you can use backbreaking to reduce that further. So in actual reality with Starships design they are quite close. I guess ChatGPT is pretty good.

> I guess ChatGPT is pretty good. Just because you listened to podcast doesn't mean you know what you are talking about. Cuz your arguments are clearly all hype a surface knowledge. The biggest chunk of deltaV there is the LEO Removing it makes trip to mars 160% more expensive. And "Areobreaking" is already counted in the trip to mars. You also conveniently forget about the fact that mars spaceship will be much heavi…

My statement was "From an energy perspective its not that much more complex"

Factually speaking my argument is correct by how most humans view this answer. But you have to poke holes in it because you knew it was correct. Its fucking ridiculous to say 'excluding LEO' then its incorrect. That might be relevant if we started from LEO but we don't. Self owned.

Lets remember what you said:

> The one way trip to mars is orders of magnitude more complicated than moon.

So my response correcting that is simply appropriate and correct, its certainty not 'multitude' orders of magnitude more complex. Specifically when talking about a one way trip.

Its easy to see how people who haven't study the subject wouldn't think how small the difference is energy wise is reading your statement. And the longer habitation is well within what we have been able to do for decades. So neither qualifies with 'orders of magnitude'. And that includes the Starship would be heavier argument.

So the simply reality is your statement was flat out wrong.

Then your other statement about radiation was fucking ridiculously wrong but you somehow refuse to acknowledge that.

Since you have no fucking leg to stand on regarding nuclear, you decided to move the goal post and find a new topic.

The actual studies you quote go against your argument, significant space time can be massively mitigated by training. As the Russian astronaut who is the world leading expert on the topic has demonstrated. One of the problem on ISS is that astronauts on ISS are incredibly busy and can't do that as much training as a Mars crew would have time for. For a Mars mission, where they don't get new instruments and experiments sent all the time, physical preparation for Mars, would be one of their primary activities.

We can't know for certain, but from everything we know, training at 3.7m/s2 should be more then sufficient with dedicated training. I always believed NASA should have invest in a rotation station so these effects can be studied better. But in the absence of that, we have to draw conclusion from micrografity research and that seems to indicate it will be fine.

> How would fetus develop in such environment.

Wow, just picking up the goal post and running down field. If we are at the point where we have to seriously think about this point I have already won the argument anyway.

> Its very convenient to overlook actual small details that dont fit a narrative.

I'm simply addressing your points, not laying out a comprehensive plan. I am refuting your points, not making points of my own. So claiming I'm ignoring points you haven't even brought up is dumb.

Are you seriously acting like those points you brought up somehow aren't thought about by SpaceX, NASA and co?

> I am done with this thread as you are just stubborn kid parroting same old bs hype people produce to justify their existence.

Funny how how the people at SpaceX, NASA, ESA and friends, who want to make this happen are 'bs hype people'. How NASA papers and simply math on the subject is 'bs hype'. Sorry for repeating that nonsense.

I didn't know you personally are an old veteran who did all the research on the objections yourself, right? You made your own orbital dynamics calculation. You calculated the mass difference and have clear assumption about the weight of different Starship version. You have detailed calculation on aerobraking efficiency of different vehicle and how that effects delta/V. You have personally looked at the data from decades of human health studies in microg.

Sorry I just didn't know that you were such a genius who hovers above us 'kids'. I humbly apologize and bow to you enlightened wisdom.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#888

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> though the government did not capitulate. Weirdly, that's how it almost always works out. Didn't work in England, didn't work in Germany, not working in Ukraine. Kinda makes that "though" look silly in retrospect. That's why today we consider bombing civilians to have no military utility.

Yet you ignore some very well known successful recent bombing campaigns: - NATO in Libya in 2011 - Operation Iraqi Freedom - Operation Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan) - US and coalition campaign against ISIS - Saudi bombing in Yemen have pretty much stalled the Houthis. - Russia in Syria for the last decade - France in the Sahel - The Turks in Iraq and Syria, been going on for almost a decade. - Israel against Hezboll…

Did they specifically work by making the citizens push the government to capitulate? For that matter, could any of them have been successfully carried out with V1's? I'm not familiar with all of those, but I would wager no, in which case they're irrelevant to my point.

No one sane is disputing that bombing can have value, but modern military bombing is done with (relatively) precise strikes against militarily useful targets, not indiscriminate attacks on civilians. When Israel bombs a civilian building, it's at least because they think there are Hamas fighters or weapons there.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#889

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet you ignore some very well known successful recent bombing campaigns: - NATO in Libya in 2011 - Operation Iraqi Freedom - Operation Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan) - US and coalition campaign against ISIS - Saudi bombing in Yemen have pretty much stalled the Houthis. - Russia in Syria for the last decade - France in the Sahel - The Turks in Iraq and Syria, been going on for almost a decade. - Israel against Hezboll…

Did they specifically work by making the citizens push the government to capitulate? For that matter, could any of them have been successfully carried out with V1's? I'm not familiar with all of those, but I would wager no, in which case they're irrelevant to my point. No one sane is disputing that bombing can have value, but modern military bombing is done with (relatively) precise strikes against militarily useful…

  > Did they specifically work by making the citizens push the government to capitulate?
That's a good question, I really don't know. I'll try to read a bit this weekend, thank you.

Re: Super Heavy has splashed down in The Gulf of Mexico

#890

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you don't understand my comment on the energy perspective you shouldn't comment on the topic. > What ship?!? Labs, medical facilities wtf r u smoking. The Starship. SpaceX is currently building an interior for the Moon Lander together with NASA that will have those things. For a small crew its totally possible to have this. Not sure what to tell you. > And why dont you mention how many fueling launches you need to…

wow. ok keep on reading marketing pamphlets. I am done with you. Now you are either outright lying or are ignorant to the point where you actually believe any bs musk says. I mean, I ask you a question and you straight up talk about something else... what else is there to say... you are like a politician on tv. Talks, talks, talks but doesn't say anything. Its pointless arguing with parrot.

You said "Anything Mars is pure BS. Just anything and everything."

But I'm reading marketing. What you saying isn't even pamphlets or propaganda. Its just flat out fucking stupid.

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