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The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

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Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#391

Post by auno »

rustyboy wrote: post #225
detourdog wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The disorder is how they affect their social surroundings. Everyone is on the spectrum and the disordered are having social problems.

Out of curiosity, given it is a spectrum, what's at the other end of "really" autisitc (if that's even the right word) or does that just go from 0 being "normal" to 1 being that "really"?

It sounds like what you are thinking of is a spectrum more in the sense of a range, where one end is "least" and the other "most". There was an interesting article[0] making the rounds a few years ago arguing that it's more like the color spectrum. While there is an underlying linear value to the color spectrum in the wavelength, you don't really talk about red being "more" of a color than blue just because it has longer wavelength. Instead, we talk about combining, and sometimes mixing, colors. The article author argue that the autism spectrum is like that; it's made up of individual traits that make a whole. As I understand it, diagnosis is in part looking at the number of those traits that a person exhibit. Severity would then be a perpendicular axis to the spectrum of traits.

[0] https://neuroclastic.com/its-a-spectrum-doesnt-mean-what-you...

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#392

Post by AmericanChopper »

bradleyjg wrote: post #145
akozak wrote: post #104

I have a lot of experience working with the weird nerd archetype and watching them navigate large orgs. First it's absolutely true that orgs that purport to support weird nerds will revert back to rewarding politicians. I've seen it happen, and typically has to do with who is doling out money. However, in my experience the vast majority of brilliant nerds way overextend themselves, and are much too confident outside…

However, in my experience the vast majority of brilliant nerds way overextend themselves, and are much too confident outside their domain. They're also much more likely to be jerks and will tumble from conflict to conflict until they get their way by attrition or status. Conflicts are strangely more personal because so much ego is tied up into it. They're more likely to assume they're right in every (non-tech/science…

> You have an employee that’s brilliant in technical area X but also has very strong and very wrong opinions about how the company ought to structure its cap table, pay its cleaning staff, and market to potential customers. He gets into constant arguments about these things. What do you do?

The same thing you do with any highly anti-social employee, fire them. It doesn’t matter how sophisticated their technical skills are, if they are incapable of transforming that into value for the company, then their value to the organisation is at best nothing, and more likely negative.

Companies/institutions are social systems, and the phrase “politics” is mostly just used to refer to “social skills”. If too many of the participants are corrupt or incompetent then the social network of the organisation can become especially toxic. But that’s a different problem to the fact that if you want to contribute value in such a system, you need to have social skills.

Can you get value out of somebody who has terrible social skills? Maybe sometimes, but it takes a lot of babysitting. Even then, you’ll never be able to properly trust that you’ll be able to rely on them to do anything ever. So it’s almost never worth the cost.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#393

Post by dghf »

015a wrote: post #278
walt_grata wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I duno on some of that. Until I was about 39 I was a "weird nerd" and then my wife (Dr of special education) finally convinced me to talk to a Dr and get get tested for autism. Turns out I'm ASD 1, would have been Asperger's in the past. Autism has a very wide range of ways it shows itself.

The article literally reads: > I recently argued that many Weird Nerds (I called them autistics, but people really hated that) These are the same thing. The author recognizes that. Everyone recognizes that.

They are not the same thing. Not all weird nerds have autism, and not all people with autism are weird nerds.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#395

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #387
TeMPOraL wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do some people's problems get the validation of the medical system and others don't? Because there are effective forms of treatment available, but are gated by diagnosis because of $reasons. Validation of the medical system enables one to access those treatments, perhaps most important of which is being able to tell yourself, as well as others, that you're having an actual problem and are not "just lazy" or nee…

I want a diagnosis of ADHD so I get free speed :)

I'm pretty sure that I would get a diagnosis of ADHD, because of my experience (in my youth) with amphetamines. Everyone else would be off their heads and I felt really focused and together (and could sleep!).

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#396

Post by gr__or »

tqi wrote: post #328

The idea that IQ and EQ are negatively correlated is dubious at best. I would venture a guess that the vast majority of "Weird Nerds" are not Katalin Karikós, and instead are simply difficult jerks who are not nearly as smart as they think they are. Hubris mixed with obstinance is a recipe for misanthropy. Also, the notion that the internet is a place where your outputs are judged solely on their merits, so that you…

I find it dubious to make this comparison in an article which does not talk about EQ, but about ability (willingness?) to play company politics. I'd wager that one is *at most* slightly correlated with EQ.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#397

Post by xenocratus »

cbozeman wrote: post #360
mmcgaha wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better response would be to tell them you are done trying to convince them because you own the responsibility and consequences of the decision. "You're out of your depth" is an insult and is intended to be one.

"You're out of your depth" is an insult to someone with an excessive ego. If you're not actually out of your depth, you won't be insulted by it. I don't get insulted when someone says I'm stupid. Because that is not true, and I know it isn't true. It isn't the things we know to be untrue that insults us - it's the things that we know to be true, that we can't accept - or even worse - can't see about ourselves that in…

> or even worse - can't see about ourselves that insult us

Isn't this the point of the previous comment? That the WN thinks they're not out of their depth and can't see that about themselves. So it is an insult from that perspective.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#398

Post by michaelt »

faeriechangling wrote: post #320
alpaca128 wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you ask autistic men or how did you come to that weird conclusion? They likely mask just as much as women, even if you may not notice from the outside (which is the point of masking). I agree about medicine not really being the solution, though. If an environment requires masking all meds can do is suppress symptoms, at best.

CAT-Q survey results mostly, a screening tool designed to detect masking, and autistic men report masking a statistically insignificant less than neurotypical men. Autistic women report masking a statistically insignificant more than neurotypical women. But the women did report masking a significant amount more than the men. Not strong evidence but what exactly is the evidence that autistics are going around masking…

A lot of the stuff I hear people describing as masking is stuff that a few decades ago would have been called professionalism, or manners, or charm, or empathy.

When I'm meeting with representatives of a client, and one of them makes a suggestion that I know won't work, and I refrain from instantly and publicly shooting down their idea and instead I make a show of considering it, then ask them a probing question or two that let them realise the problem with the idea themselves - am I masking? Or am I merely being professional?

When I see something worthy of a compliment and I rehearse it in my mind to make sure it isn't objectifying or creepy, and that it's personalised to them and shows I paid attention to and understood the thing I'm complimenting - am I masking? Or just being charming?

When I'm socialising with people who are talking about their struggles to lose weight, and I in many years going to the gym have struggled to gain weight or visible muscle, but I keep my mouth shut rather than trying to build rapport about our shared inability to reach our target weight because I've tried it and I know it doesn't work - am I masking? Or just showing a normal level of social skills and empathy?

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#399

Post by 7bit »

esskay wrote: post #380
CalRobert wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This bizarre romanticization of autism is frustrating for those who are or have loved ones who are nonverbal, stim all day, etc.. I almost wonder if nerfing autism to the point where it's a fun thing to talk about having on tiktok is a way to demonize effective interventions so insurance companies won't have to pay for them.

It's been a similar pattern with ADHD, it feels like its almost been turned into a trend. Although that being said we've had a number of people at our place been diagnosed with ADHD, Autism and in some cases both, all developers, all within the last 3-5 years, and you know what, they're absolutely correct diagnosis. It's a mix of romanticization and a change in acceptance and understanding of the two, and they do oft…

Almost? I constantly see (at least couple weeks back) videos about how they behave a certain way because they have ADHD, or what ADHD people prefer to do in certain situations. Most of them are populistic and factually complete bullshit. They do people with ADHD a disserviceall Uhr Maisinformation they spread. And why? Because somehow it's hip zo say zo have ADHD.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#400

Post by normie3000 »

ModernMech wrote: post #346
abracadaniel wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The anti-diagnosis attitude is surprising on a site like this. Everyone could do better with a better understanding of their own mind, whether it meets the criteria of a disorder or not. And with any kind of better understanding we need more and better categorizations.

A lot of people who post here meet the diagnostic criteria, and maybe they aren't ready to confront something new and scary about themselves. That's fine, it's something one needs to do when ready. Easier to say "That doesn't apply to me" if you're not ready to do the work; confronting an ASD diagnosis late in life is not an easy task.

What is "the work"?
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