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The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

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Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#21

Post by doublerabbit »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #18
doublerabbit wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ask, if that person is truly unpleasant have you spoken to them about how unpleasant they are? Not to defend but how is someone to recognise a fault of their own if they're not called upon? Unless its truly terrible and they know they are doing it on purpose. The issue we live in nowadays we are all scared how to tell each other how we feel towards and that we now safe harbour them by throwing them a label and appr…

Sometimes, yes, we talk to them. But I'm a DM, not their therapist or their dad - I'm not obligated to hand-hold someone through a radical restructuring of their personality. And, it might not surprise you to find out, some people react very badly to being criticized. And I'm not particularly interested in having an argument over my subjective opinion of a person. I just don't want to be around them anymore.

I suppose, and that's fair enough. I just tend to trial their behaviour.

"No that's not alright, cut the crap otherwise your out of here"

Why play with them and not just cut them out completely? By keeping them in group your only enforcing their unpleasantness.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#22

Post by jacobolus »

ianbicking wrote: post #4

There's definitely been a move to demand individuals be good at everything... old stereotypes of the nerd brought a lot of negatives, but they were also apologetic, acknowledging the trade off, that paying attention deeply to one thing does lead to being worse at other things. The exact stereotype differed by domain... the performer who is a diva, the self destructive author, the manic artist... each with a hint of n…

"Performer who is a diva" is not directly about focusing on one thing at the expense of another. Performers are trained to be divas by having no real friends willing to confront them, and by being infantilized by the people around them who lie about their faults, are excessively accommodating of bullshit, and don't ever make them take responsibility for mistakes or reflect on their impact on other people. The result is often the same for people in positions of authority, such as CEOs. Cf. Elon Musk.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#23

Post by icodemuch »

Yossarrian22 wrote: post #5

The author is missing a crucial pressure that pushes against weird nerds, the people that have to work underneath them. I’ve had to answer to a Weird Nerd when I was starting out in my field, it was the worst fucking experience of my life, and I’ve spent the years since warning people away from that person, their career and their contributions to their field have stagnated due to all the people like me that they burn…

I read the article as acknowledging this pressure by arguing that Weird Nerds should not be forced into people management positions. Without the workplace pressure on Weird Nerds to become people managers, would they still manage people? Maybe not.

I can’t speak for academia, but in tech companies I’ve worked at I’ve seen a marked improvement in management when there’s a tech track for engineer advancement such that they never need to become managers, if they don’t want.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#24

Post by orwin »

Waterluvian wrote: post #2

I’m not sure I follow the first sentence. What does this have to do with Women in STEM? (I’m not being political. I just don’t follow the connection)

It's because of a lot of the people who push for more women in STEM (i think there is a movement called that too) also called out Karico for her vision on politiking and asskissing in academia (and science in general. My sister interned in a private lab in the past spring, it seemed to be even worse than academia on those point, although the pay was way better).

It's not a dig at the movement or their values, i do think its a minority who do this, but its a vocal minority who might be capturing the movement (i don't think this is the case, but this is a danger. look at what HAES as become).

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#25

Post by lainga »

idiotsecant wrote: post #19
lainga wrote: post #8

> I still stand by my association of Weird Nerds with autism, but for some reason people really do not like to call Weird Nerds autistic. I'm sorry, what , even if they're preponderant you can't just call all of them that any more than you can collectively call all basketball players "Marfan Syndrome havers"

Tell me honestly that most weird nerds are not on the spectrum and I might be able to work up enough energy to clutch my pearls at this. I say this as a weird nerd who is definitely on the spectrum, like I suspect many HN readers are.

Allow me a bit of poetic license with the original statement and maybe it will explain my objection better.

> but for some reason people really do not like to call marathon winners "Kenyans".

Why might other marathon runners not like being lumped in with that country, given its incredible winningness at long-distance racing?

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#26

Post by idiotsecant »

The path of the weird nerd has never been easy. Humans are inherently social animals and when you don't fully fit that mold you will, by definition, exist somewhat on the perimeter of society, no matter how valuable your skills.

The best thing for a Weird Nerd to do is to find a trustworthy 'patron' who can appreciate that it benefits them to handle the messy human stuff and let the Weird Nerd do the nerd work. The problem is that Weird Nerds are often terrible at figuring out who is trustworthy and a good fit for a symbiotic relationship like this.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#27

Post by Michelangelo11 »

I do think it's a major issue that academia is increasingly bureaucratic and corporate, but I don't quite agree with the article. It's not that very smart, truth-motivated people have bad people skills (e.g., off the top of my head - von Neumann, Feynman, and Newton were all pretty good with people when they needed to be), it's that they are motivated largely by discovery and not by status and money. But academia today is essentially a machine for amassing status and money at the expense of creating genuine new knowledge, which drives away those who want to create knowledge.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#28

Post by doublerabbit »

idiotsecant wrote: post #20
doublerabbit wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ask, if that person is truly unpleasant have you spoken to them about how unpleasant they are? Not to defend but how is someone to recognise a fault of their own if they're not called upon? Unless its truly terrible and they know they are doing it on purpose. The issue we live in nowadays we are all scared how to tell each other how we feel towards and that we now safe harbour them by throwing them a label and appr…

I think we both know the kind of That Guy we're talking about and a conversation isn't going to change things.

Okay, moot. But in that case why keep them active in group? Why tolerate it in the first place.

Maybe I'm just to compassionate.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#29

Post by wumbo »

doublerabbit wrote: post #12
pavel_lishin wrote: post #6

Everyone get your bucket ready, I'm going to throw an anecdote into it. I play D&D. This exposes me to a wide variety of people, but unsurprisingly, a lot of them are probably what the author would consider Weird Nerds. Most of them are perfectly pleasant people, and I look forward to spending time in their company, both in the context of playing D&D, and just as a way to socialize. Heck, at my last session, a player…

I ask, if that person is truly unpleasant have you spoken to them about how unpleasant they are? Not to defend but how is someone to recognise a fault of their own if they're not called upon? Unless its truly terrible and they know they are doing it on purpose. The issue we live in nowadays we are all scared how to tell each other how we feel towards and that we now safe harbour them by throwing them a label and appr…

If it’s their general emotional candor, I don’t think it’s worth wondering if they are self aware.

Not your emotions, not your circus.

Re: The Weird Nerd comes with trade-offs

#30

Post by FormerBandmate »

Michelangelo11 wrote: post #27

I do think it's a major issue that academia is increasingly bureaucratic and corporate, but I don't quite agree with the article. It's not that very smart, truth-motivated people have bad people skills (e.g., off the top of my head - von Neumann, Feynman, and Newton were all pretty good with people when they needed to be), it's that they are motivated largely by discovery and not by status and money. But academia tod…

Academia pays absolutely terribly for an elite job, it's all status. You could make more than 90% of tenured professors as a manager of Buc-ee's
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