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The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

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Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#21
post #14
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the professor was there to set the curriculum and force you to study (things that otherwise you didn't know were important or didn't want to pick on your own That's what it means to NOT be self-taught. That you got an organized overview of a subject in a systematic manner. What was the expectation otherwise? That somehow another person instilled all your knowledge directly into your brain?

> What was the expectation otherwise? That somehow another person instilled all your knowledge directly into your brain? Perhaps close instruction and observation and correction? More like an apprenticeship, or the way your parents may have taught you how to ride a bike or use utensils etc etc, which differs markedly from a professor speaking to a large group and leaving the struggle and attempt to master a subject t…

>Perhaps close instruction and observation and correction?

You have lectures (with questions and discussion), labs, assignments and corrections, and so on. Obviously the lectures and such are not one on one, but given to the class you're in. It would be expensive and require dozens of different professors just for one person to cover all study subjects with a degree.

Also a lot of it concerns learning about stuff you were pointed to by reading the relevant material, so it's can't be done similarly to the one to one teaching a tacticle thing, like how to handle glass blowing to get into the guild, or how to ride a bike.

Still, regardless of what it contains, the difference between self-studying or not is that in the latter you are given a systematic, organized, curriculum to follow.

And it's the quite common idiosyncratic mix-and-match, and jumping from subject to subject, and often lacking foundational knowledge in base areas, that academics look down on those who "self-studied".

Or course if someone studied by themselves in an equally systematic and organized way as a university curriculum, coverting the same bases and expanding in a similar way, they'd not really be "self-studied" in the spirit of the term, just nominally.

But traditionally that was hard or impossible - and in any case, very rare (the other kind of haphazard self-studied person was far more common). Now with the internet and easy access to information, it's somewhat easier, what you need is heavy discipline.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#22

On one hand, there's this. On the other hand, with the toughening of the job market, companies are selecting by degrees and pedigrees more than ever. The last company I worked for is currently doing this exactly, only looking at applications from people graduating from select universities. So far it's working for them. As the job market gets worse, I think this trend of stronger emphasis on degrees and pedigrees will…

> So far it's working for them. As the job market gets worse, I think this trend of stronger emphasis on degrees and pedigrees will only get stronger. In retrospect, some of the worst advice I got from the internet and even the real world was that college was overrated. I did well in college, went above and beyond in my studies, and learned a lot. But I did not go to the most prestigious university I could have atten…

Pro tip, people hate ivy droppers. The only people who will respond well are other people who went to the same ivy as you. The value of an Ivy Education is that you become friends with people who have rich parents, and those people bring you into the stuff they start because they have the capital to do whatever they want.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#23

On one hand, there's this. On the other hand, with the toughening of the job market, companies are selecting by degrees and pedigrees more than ever. The last company I worked for is currently doing this exactly, only looking at applications from people graduating from select universities. So far it's working for them. As the job market gets worse, I think this trend of stronger emphasis on degrees and pedigrees will…

> So far it's working for them. As the job market gets worse, I think this trend of stronger emphasis on degrees and pedigrees will only get stronger. In retrospect, some of the worst advice I got from the internet and even the real world was that college was overrated. I did well in college, went above and beyond in my studies, and learned a lot. But I did not go to the most prestigious university I could have atten…

[dead]

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#24
The deep irony of praising autodidacticism in lieu of getting a degree is that one has to be a world class autodidact to succeed in a Ph.D program and that a university is stuffed to the brim with resources to support that autodidacticism: libraries, lab facilities, experts, etc. for both graduate and undergraduate studies. And not in just in one field, but dozens and dozens of fields.

A real autodidact would be in seventh heaven at a university. These kids are just trying to put a good face on being "too cool for school".

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somehow, late stage capitalism seems to bring us to this winner-take-all environment. We are being separated into rich and poor and forced farther and farther apart. In large part for the reasons you stated, I'm sending one kid to a $100k per year private university instead of the $7k per year state school. I was helping my kid try to apply for summer jobs. It involved a lot of 2FA apps and QR codes, which needed to…

As a child who went through this, I could not put a child of my own through that system; I couldn’t do the pointless teacher-pleasing busy-work and it took a piece of my soul and childhood away. On the other hand, I totally understand the necessity of it. Squaring the circle on those two contradictory feelings was quite simple for me - simply don’t have children. I thought I was a bit unusual for that, buy it seems t…

Is it really necessary? I'm not seeing it.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somehow, late stage capitalism seems to bring us to this winner-take-all environment. We are being separated into rich and poor and forced farther and farther apart. In large part for the reasons you stated, I'm sending one kid to a $100k per year private university instead of the $7k per year state school. I was helping my kid try to apply for summer jobs. It involved a lot of 2FA apps and QR codes, which needed to…

As a child who went through this, I could not put a child of my own through that system; I couldn’t do the pointless teacher-pleasing busy-work and it took a piece of my soul and childhood away. On the other hand, I totally understand the necessity of it. Squaring the circle on those two contradictory feelings was quite simple for me - simply don’t have children. I thought I was a bit unusual for that, buy it seems t…

[dead]

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the ultimate university degree, the PhD, is all about learning how to learn. It's unlikely that you will continue to work on the project you did your dissertation on where you spent 3 to 6 years becoming an expert on in grad school. The point wasn't getting the knowledge, it was developing the skills to get up to speed on a new topic quickly.

Does it really deliver on that though?

Well, you are required to learn about some largish thing that nobody could teach you because nobody knew.

I don't know if it teaches self-learning, but it surely ensures you know it.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a child who went through this, I could not put a child of my own through that system; I couldn’t do the pointless teacher-pleasing busy-work and it took a piece of my soul and childhood away. On the other hand, I totally understand the necessity of it. Squaring the circle on those two contradictory feelings was quite simple for me - simply don’t have children. I thought I was a bit unusual for that, buy it seems t…

Is it really necessary? I'm not seeing it.

I have friends who did not go the college degree route and it is very grim.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#29

The deep irony of praising autodidacticism in lieu of getting a degree is that one has to be a world class autodidact to succeed in a Ph.D program and that a university is stuffed to the brim with resources to support that autodidacticism: libraries, lab facilities, experts, etc. for both graduate and undergraduate studies. And not in just in one field, but dozens and dozens of fields. A real autodidact would be in s…

Being at university helps but accessing those resources doesn’t necessarily require attending, which is out of reach for many people for many different reasons. When I was in high school I emailed a few professors at my local university (Caltech/MIT/Ivy league tier) and they allowed me to audit graduate level classes, participate in labs and group projects, and sponsored visiting faculty status so I could officially borrow books and lab equipment. Maybe this doesn’t scale if everyone starts pestering professors at research universities, but everyone I’ve met in academia has been extremely receptive to helping autodidacts access university resources without attending. At the coal face of a university, everyone is still dedicated to education afterall.

Re: The Era of the Autodidact Is Here (2018)

#30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So far it's working for them. As the job market gets worse, I think this trend of stronger emphasis on degrees and pedigrees will only get stronger. In retrospect, some of the worst advice I got from the internet and even the real world was that college was overrated. I did well in college, went above and beyond in my studies, and learned a lot. But I did not go to the most prestigious university I could have atten…

Pro tip, people hate ivy droppers. The only people who will respond well are other people who went to the same ivy as you. The value of an Ivy Education is that you become friends with people who have rich parents, and those people bring you into the stuff they start because they have the capital to do whatever they want.

I'm pretty skeptical of the networking with rich people theory. Of course, it happens. But I'm not sure it's a rationale, by itself, to go to Harvard if you can. While I've done business with various people I know in school I can't point to any clear examples where some opportunity came along because of school connections. Professional connections, yes, in pretty much every case. But very little to do with school.
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