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Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

cull.io

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Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#71

Post by exim »

ksat wrote: post #19
Apreche wrote: post #13

Want to work here? Do work for us for free! Then maybe we'll hire you afterwards. Great idea if you want to hire suckers.

OP here. Agree with this sentiment. Even I would not use cull.io to have candidates build a complex web app that would take days or even hours to build. I would use it as a tool to "Filter" candidates, not "Select" them. (It's amazing how the simplest of a coding challenge would filter all non-coding coders) thanks for the review.

I've never been on the other(interviewer) side of the hiring process and I was on another side only once during the last decade, so I might not have enough insight, but I really don't understand non-coding coders filtering per se, be it your method or FizzBuzz... When someone says about their years of experience in coding in their CV, is it a common case that they're lying?

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#72

Post by corry »

dotjinks wrote: post #49
corry wrote: post #42

Leaving aside whether or not this is a valid way to attract top people, my suggestion is to rebrand the name - "cull" has too negative a connotation ("cull the herd"). So #1, I'm part of "the herd", and #2 this tool is being used to possibly cull me. Great. No thanks, I'll spend my time applying to a place that doesn't have a tool dedicated to weeding me out. It doesn't portray the hiring org or your tool very well.…

Cull is perfect from HR's point of view and speaks to the heart of the problem they are having trying to find viable candidates in a sea of resumes.

Yes, it speaks to HR's problem - but in a way that jeopardizes their objective (i.e. hiring good people).

Quality devs are in short supply already... explicitly saying that you're treating them like cattle is not going to result in better outcomes. If good devs don't participate = this is worse than a regular process.

In my experience, devs want to feel wanted / valued / pursued, not like commodities that need to be filtered.

/your experience may vary

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#73

Post by sigkill »

exim wrote: post #71
ksat wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Agree with this sentiment. Even I would not use cull.io to have candidates build a complex web app that would take days or even hours to build. I would use it as a tool to "Filter" candidates, not "Select" them. (It's amazing how the simplest of a coding challenge would filter all non-coding coders) thanks for the review.

I've never been on the other(interviewer) side of the hiring process and I was on another side only once during the last decade, so I might not have enough insight, but I really don't understand non-coding coders filtering per se, be it your method or FizzBuzz... When someone says about their years of experience in coding in their CV, is it a common case that they're lying?

Maybe not lying per se, but embellishing the truth definitely occurs. It isn't unheard of people not being able to conceptually plow through the FizzBuzz even with a few years of experience.

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#75

Post by drumdance »

Apreche wrote: post #13

Want to work here? Do work for us for free! Then maybe we'll hire you afterwards. Great idea if you want to hire suckers.

Depends on the economy, I would guess. I haven't had to do a lot of hiring recently, but a couple years ago at my last company we found ourselves overwhelmed with applicants to PHP programming jobs. We created an application tool that asked applicants to solve a few PHP puzzles. These weren't super-hard MIT-level questions, just basic FizzBuzz. We found it to be a very effective screening process.

This probably works best for entry level/junior programmers responding to a help wanted ad. Senior people are being proactively recruited.

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#76

Post by peterstjohn »

There's definitely some merit in this approach over something like Fizzbuzz and whiteboard problems. At my previous place of employment [1] , after the initial interview, you were given 48 hours to produce a simple web addressbook app. You could use anything that you wanted to produce the app - at the end of the 48 hour period, you had to supply thme with the code and instructions on how to install it on a Ubuntu instance. It was actually quite fun (and then after getting the job and testing other people's entries, you begin to see how it separated people with impressive CVs who couldn't program for toffee, and others who had much less experience, but managed to come up with something that worked!)

[1] That would be Open Source Integrators, a great Durham-based outfit who I believe are still looking for people to staff their Chicago offices: http://osintegrators.com/

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#77

Post by x1 »

peterstjohn wrote: post #76

There's definitely some merit in this approach over something like Fizzbuzz and whiteboard problems. At my previous place of employment [1] , after the initial interview, you were given 48 hours to produce a simple web addressbook app. You could use anything that you wanted to produce the app - at the end of the 48 hour period, you had to supply thme with the code and instructions on how to install it on a Ubuntu ins…

Great idea... but did you let them know ahead of time? I'd hate to do a phone interview and then realize I'm building a web app over my weekend trip to Chicago.

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#78

Post by ksat »

exim wrote: post #71
ksat wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP here. Agree with this sentiment. Even I would not use cull.io to have candidates build a complex web app that would take days or even hours to build. I would use it as a tool to "Filter" candidates, not "Select" them. (It's amazing how the simplest of a coding challenge would filter all non-coding coders) thanks for the review.

I've never been on the other(interviewer) side of the hiring process and I was on another side only once during the last decade, so I might not have enough insight, but I really don't understand non-coding coders filtering per se, be it your method or FizzBuzz... When someone says about their years of experience in coding in their CV, is it a common case that they're lying?

Not lying. Even I am not sure why this happens though. I think two things are at play:

a) You could survive in big enough company without coding (You survive by tinkering xml files, db records, monitoring the servers.. stuff like that)

b) Most interviews don't require you to code. They rely on stuffs like puzzles, knowledge of complex algorithms and asking you explain things about your previous work. So a candidates keeps getting good at that since that's what is required to get the next job.

But i am not entirely sure. It surprises me too.

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#79

Post by peterstjohn »

x1 wrote: post #77
peterstjohn wrote: post #76

There's definitely some merit in this approach over something like Fizzbuzz and whiteboard problems. At my previous place of employment [1] , after the initial interview, you were given 48 hours to produce a simple web addressbook app. You could use anything that you wanted to produce the app - at the end of the 48 hour period, you had to supply thme with the code and instructions on how to install it on a Ubuntu ins…

Great idea... but did you let them know ahead of time? I'd hate to do a phone interview and then realize I'm building a web app over my weekend trip to Chicago.

The nice thing was that after you passed the initial interview, the company would let you start whenever (within reason, obviously). You'd send them an email that you were ready, they'd send details, and the clock would start ticking from then. Much more relaxed.

Re: Show HN: Recruit web developers by having them build a web app

#80

Post by pbreit »

Apreche wrote: post #13

Want to work here? Do work for us for free! Then maybe we'll hire you afterwards. Great idea if you want to hire suckers.

Did you look at the site? It's more like interview questions than free work. While I doubt this service will find the cream of the crop, it could be useful for broader-based programmer hiring.
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