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Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

haaretz.com

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Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#661

Post by throw310822 »

Levitz wrote: post #471
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But in general what strategy do you need? Take over, destroy the military infra and prevent smuggling. That's all that is needed. Gaza is thousand years back, it will never recover. It is not a threat anymore in any meaningful way. Impressively amoral post, but this is insanity. (1) Israel doesn't exist in a vacuum. It is not self-sufficient. (2) There's something monstrous about keeping 2M people herded up in a cl…

>Whether or not those people are "threats" shall remain to be seen, but Israel is going to lose (is, already, losing) the hearts and minds of everybody on the planet under age 40 At this point, I think these are not the real power dynamics. I used to think Israel needed western support to exist. I don't do anymore. Now I believe that Israel needs any support, and they are perfectly fine with the idea of allying with…

I have no doubts that Israel is willing to search for support anywhere it can find it. Yet, this doesn't mean that they don't need the western one to keep with their standards of living, political standing in the west, and self-identification as a modern western country. A serious political condemnation and sanctions would be enough to steer Israel towards a different course- provided that the radicalisation of society hasn't already reached a point of no return.

On the other hand, the US certainly doesn't need an ally that creates far more problems than it resolves. Their solid, oil-rich ally in the region is Saudi Arabia. The power dynamic between Israel and the US is not that of a client-state and its powerful protector or even one between allies; it resembles more that of a narcissistic, abusive lover towards their submissive partner. This is why we have been seeing the entire US government utterly humiliating itself for the past few months, finding pathetic excuses to pretend they haven't been slapped in the face every single day, while reiterating their unconditional love and swearing that their partner never did anything wrong.

Really, there is no rational (in the sense of geo-political or strategic) explanation for this. It's a psychological subjugation.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#662

Post by YeGoblynQueenne »

myth_drannon wrote: post #568
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #513

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. It is very obvious, as Levitz points out above, that Israel can just cozy up to the Chinese or the Russians if Uncle Sam washes its hands of it, China and Russia who would jump at the chance to gain a foothold in the Middle East, right next door to all those industrial juice springs. If I may. But even if that were not the case 20 years is plenty of time to cleanse Gaza, and the West Bank with it, of ever…

[flagged]

That's hard to square with the reality on the ground: tens of thousand killed, millions displaced, half of all buildings damaged and the Palestinians can do nothing to stop it, but they're "perfectly capable" of genocide?

Israel has a fully mechanised army, tanks, F16s, drones, rockets, bombs, nukes, while Hamas has ... their grandpas' hand-me down AK-47s? What are they gonna do to genocide the Israelis? Give them the evil eye?

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#663

Post by throw310822 »

wonderwonder wrote: post #243
throw310822 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not Jewish, it's pro-Israel (American Israel Public Affair Committee). Israel is a foreign country whose interests might be conflicting with those of the US. That's different, don't you think?

you going to ignore OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews? Odd that people are only concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is? https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...

> OP's mention of "Dual Citizens" clearly meaning Jews

"Dual citizens" clearly means "dual citizens". If the OP had the information that many Jews in Congress were dual citizens, he was wrong- although in fairness it's an understandable false belief when you have US politicians coming to Congress wearing their IDF uniform or propose laws to give IDF veterans the same benefits that US veterans receive.

> concerned with AIPAC and not the other foreign PACS. Wonder what the differentiating factor is?

Just look at the the first PAC in the list you mentioned: it's Accenture. Classified as foreign because their headquarter is in an empty office of a tax haven. AIPAC is not even in this list: it's in the "ideology/ single issue" list, where it stands as the only pro- PAC in the list (and the 4th largest).

https://www.opensecrets.org/political-action-committees-pacs...

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#664

Post by ab5tract »

shiroiushi wrote: post #597
Terr_ wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Or as I have been saying since the 1990's, the only difference between marketing and propaganda is that with marketing at least you are trying to peddle a product instead of an ideology. I disagree, ideologies are often already in there, even when they are simplistic "power-tools are for men and all men require power-tools", or "having better stuff than your neighbors is a virtue, failing to do so will lead to dang…

>I disagree, ideologies are often already in there, even when they are simplistic "power-tools are for men and all men require power-tools" I disagree. This isn't peddling an ideology, it's using an existing ideology (or stereotype) in order to peddle a product. A company with a marketing campaign targeting men isn't going to refuse to sell power tools to women, they're just designing their marketing campaign in a wa…

What you have described is, in fact, a mode of perpetuating ideology. If what you awere saying were accurate, it would absolve all capitalistic endeavors of reinforcing ideology, even the essential ideology of capitalism inherent in those endeavors.

That’s not how this works. “The medium is the message,” as Marshall McLuhan would say.

A woman may never consider buying power tools because of the imagery of the propaganda surrounding power tools. Or the salesman may undermine, intimidate, or otherwise obstruct her attempts to purchase one. But regardless your point falls apart because the ideology of capitalism underlying the power tools on the shelf subsumes the ideology of the advertising.

That subsumption, however, does not in any way contraindicate those ideologies present in the advertisement’s framing. It only demonstrates that money is more important than the other ideologies being peddled.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#665

Post by StanislavPetrov »

chipdart wrote: post #656
StanislavPetrov wrote: post #622

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The total amount of direct evidence (evidence, not assertions of secret evidence by the US government, unproven and unsubstantiated allegations of hacking or superman Bernie memes by click farms based somewhere in Russia) that Russia has "interfered" with US politics that has been released by the US government in the last 10 years adds up to less than the evidence in this article on Israel alone. Evidence aside, I pe…

> that Russia has "interfered" with US politics that has been released by the US government in the last 10 years adds up to (...) So you acknowledge that it's quite clear that Russia indeed is systematically interfering, and your only claim is to call "what about" some other country?

No, I acknowledge that some interference by Russia and other countries is likely but not clear, since no clear evidence has ever been publicly offered. The only public evidence of clear, systemic, long-standing and ongoing interference we have is that of Israel.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#666

Post by DrScientist »

SkipperCat wrote: post #4

Not a comment about who's right or wrong in this war, but it is fascinating that we have entered the age of the Internet being a place where warfare is fought. There have always been people posting web content about conflicts but now with Gaza and Ukraine, it seems that the nations fighting are actively looking at the internet as the fourth field of battle. Just waiting for a random US future president to create an "…

Look up Bell Pottinger and Iraq.

US military spent over half a billion on war propaganda - outsourced to experts.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#667

Post by goodByHN2233 »

Hackernews have become much worse than reddit/r/gossip or reddit/r/politics or reddit/r/yellowpress or whatever. Good thing, I wasted to much time here anyway.

Still I fail to understand why the mods let this happen. Maybe quantity over quality.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#668

Post by hazn »

goodByHN2233 wrote: post #667

Hackernews have become much worse than reddit/r/gossip or reddit/r/politics or reddit/r/yellowpress or whatever. Good thing, I wasted to much time here anyway. Still I fail to understand why the mods let this happen. Maybe quantity over quality.

:wave: see ya around

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#669

Post by cess11 »

myth_drannon wrote: post #367
cess11 wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you really believe this? Do you think this is an efficient way to perform military counterinsurgency? And are you really sure it's a good idea to wallow in war crimes like this in relation to the rest of the world? Something like, the UAE kind of gets away with it in Sudan currently, so Israel can use IDF like its own janjaweed?

Look at Judea&Samaria, beyond a shooting from stolen weapons nothing happens and that's without tight control over the border. Insurgency works as long as you have a constant supply of weapons. Gaza had it, but not anymore.

Why do you think that? I follow the reports from palestinian resistance and news quite closely and see no signs that the weapon supplies have been cut off.

Re: Israel reportedly used fake social accounts to garner support from US lawmakers

#670

Post by weberer »

davesque wrote: post #230
nextstep wrote: post #11

Also reported on by NY Times and posted here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40583068 but like most articles about Israeli hacking, US Big Tech involvement in the war, etc it was immediately flagged once it reached the front page. I don’t know how much of this is moderators removing posts, or if there is a pro-Israel brigade that is censoring HN’s front page.

I flagged it because it's really boring to see people go through the same predictable, tribal motions on a topic that's been covered to death by every media outlet.

Why not just click the "hide" button? Why try to prevent other people from seeing it who would be interested?
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