Don't be terrified of Pale Fire

Post by SamBam » Wed, Jun 05, 2024, 1:35 PM UTC

gizmo wrote: post #117

filleduchaos wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly - if a work really was so simple that it required no work to understand it, what insight could it possibly give into the human condition? Plenty of "simple" works are reliant on the reader already having done work to grasp it, from growing up in the right country/culture/subculture to learning the right things in school.

That’s why I talked about unnecessary complexity. Of course many hard things in life are worthwhile. I don’t think anybody would argue otherwise.

Post by MonkeyIsNull » Wed, Jun 05, 2024, 1:59 PM UTC

wmorse wrote: post #127

mlsu wrote: post #65

I read Pale Fire on the plane recently. Picked it up randomly, knew almost nothing about it. It is absolutely riotous. Most of the references probably went over my head, but I was immediately annoyed, then grinning about how annoyed I was, then tearing into the next page to try to unwrap just who the hell is Kinbote. About 10 pages in you will discover that you're never going to fully figure it out, and then the ques…

I read it randomly, too, having found it in a summer vacation house. Found it hilarious, once I finally caught on, and went back and re-read it over the summer. Isn't most "great" literature best read if you discover it yourself? Much more fun than university seminars on Tolstoevsky, не так ли?

Post by vundercind » Wed, Jun 05, 2024, 3:15 PM UTC

ubermonkey wrote: post #150

vundercind wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I tell people the UI of paper books is in most ways superior to ebook readers, this is the kind of thing I mean. They do take up a shitload less space, which is a pretty big advantage, though.

I prefer paper as an experience, but there are absolutely ways that (e.g.) a Kindle can be superior. * Control of text size * Weight I forget what it was, but at some point I was excitedly reading a new hardback -- and found it so heavy to read in bed that I bought the Kindle edition in addition to the paper one. This also applies for travel, doubly so.

Post by adolph » Wed, Jun 05, 2024, 5:07 PM UTC

recursive wrote: post #101

adolph wrote: post #9

Interesting: The connection between Pale Fire and hypertext was stated soon after its publication; in 1969, the information-technology researcher Ted Nelson obtained permission from the novel's publishers to use it for a hypertext demonstration at Brown University. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Fire

Funny to think that we're this far into the "information era", and your choices for consuming this book are either physical paper, or general (non-hypermedia) ebook.

Post by shwaj » Wed, Jun 05, 2024, 6:06 PM UTC

jws wrote: post #57

Tycho wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 'hook' of Pale Fire is this: ostensibly you're reading a long-form poem with a foreword and footnotes and editing by a friend of the poet (a poet of some eminence), but it soon becomes apparent that the editor is trying to jam his own life story into those footnotes. If you like that idea, I think you'd like the book.

Another interesting variant of "annotations are the star" is "But What of Earth?" by Piers Anthony. It's an old school sort of sci fi story, but the publisher rewrote it in the publishing process. Eventually Anthony got the rights back and published the first draft with the editor's changes and his commentary on it. I think it was intended to be commentary on the publishing business, but as a way of knowing an author…