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China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

bulgarianmilitary.com

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Re: China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

#51
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donald Trump says a lot of stuff that is intended to prey on the minds of the public. His words (let alone his signature on a treaty) mean nothing and can be revoked at any time. Until he actually does something, the singular value of statements like these is to make headlines. If everything Donald Trump said was written into policy, he'd have contradicted himself into anarchy. The parent's line of logic is sound; th…

Well the Pentagon seems to think they will. "The Pentagon Is Freaking Out About a Potential War With China" - https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2023/06/09/america-we... "...But a swift response may not be possible, in large part because of how shrunken the U.S. manufacturing base has become since the Cold War. All of a sudden, Washington is reckoning with the fact that so many parts and pieces of munitions, plan…

Because the United States has a strategy that relies on deterrence. That's what's stopping them today, and maintaining that advantage is a critical component of scaring China away from arbitrary harassment campaigns like they engage with in the Philippines.

You need to stop reading into sensationalist headlines and actually understand the strategies at-play here. This is about creating sufficient conditions for China to not invade Taiwan, not blowing each other up in a second floating Ukraine. China doesn't want that, Taiwan doesn't want that, and the United States doesn't want that either. The critical difference between posturing and realpolitik is actually doing something; China will refuse to commit to a violent invasion unless globalism fails them (hint: globalism never fails China).

Re: China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

#52
post #47
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why everybody keeps underestimating China. Their space programs started with second hand copies of Soyuz capsules, and now runs circles around the US Space program...

I think it's denial plain and simple. Americans have been fed a steady stream of propaganda that they're the best at everything and that no one else in the world even comes close -- especially military stuff. Some people just cannot conceive of a world where America isn't the best, especially militarily and they cannot conceive of a world where anyone else could ever close the gap. America spent 20 years grinding dow…

> We need wake the fuck up to the rampant corruption and graft in our society and get a manufacturing economy that benefits the little guy and not some grease-bag rent-seeking parasites who contribute nothing to society.

If I were that rent seeking parasite, I would prefer you to focus your attention and rage on China instead...

Re: China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

#53
post #45
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their space program started with second hand copies of Soyuz, and they are still currently on copies of Soyuz. But even if they were landing people on Mars right now, I don't see how that would be evidence they could win a nuclear war.

> evidence they could win a nuclear war. Well that escalated quickly! I think in that case, the artillery shell production will be last of our concerns. I see different and more feasible scenarios: An unsatisfactory peace in Ukraine that will leave neither Russia or Ukraine happy. Any political weakness or apathy from the US side, will be picked quickly by China as the best opportunity in 50 years... China will progr…

> Well that escalated quickly!

It didn't escalate quickly, you just didn't read the comment you replied to.

> I think in that case, the artillery shell production will be last of our concerns.

We're talking about the buildup of the chinese navy, not artillery shells. Though indeed, the presence of a massive nuclear arsenal renders the relative strength of conventional forces irrelevant for total war.

> China will progressively increase their exercises. First as like now to involve 50 airplanes and 20 ships...then 100 planes and 50 ships...then 250 planes and 100 ships, getting closer and closer to the last 20 to 25 miles of Taiwan, until the day the exercise will become an incursion, that goes for directly targeting heads of government. Probably by then hundreds of soldiers disguised as business men already will be in Taiwan.

I don't think you understand what is involved in launching a naval invasion. Taiwan has 23 million people, a standing army of 180,000 and 1.7 million reservists, and defensible terrain. A successful invasion without any US support would still be an undertaking an order of magnitude larger than D-day; its preparation would take months and be clearly visible to satellite imagery. Building the ships necessary to transport the troops would take years, and be at the expense of other naval production. Ships in transit and troops at mustering stations would be vulnerable to Taiwanese missile strikes. Whatever troops China managed to land would be severely outnumbered and outgunned by an entrenched opponent.

> Even if the US decides to intervene it will arrive days to weeks too late

The US would already be there. Again, they'ed have months if not years of advanced warning. There are already numerous American bases in the area, and America would likely pre-position forces on Taiwan itself if an attack was imminent. At the very least, it would lift restrictions on arms exports to Taiwan, allowing it to even better prepare its own defenses.

> You build a very strong army, either to defend or to attack. Nobody is a threat to China or want's anything from China, so they are not creating an army to defend assets...

China faced a century of humiliation because everyone wanted something from them and they had no means to defend their assets. They have long standing feuds with nearly every nation in the region. They are jockeying for position with the world's leading power. The claim they have no concerns about defense is absurd.

Re: China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

#54
post #38
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Use it for what exactly? For decades the militaries of the world have subscribed to the theory of detterence - build up a force sufficiently large that no one in their right mind will try to attack you, and thus you don't need to fight. Under such a doctrine, the entire point of the massive spending is to not use it. As we see in Ukraine, the decision to try and flex military strength can be quite disastrous when you…

I don't understand why everybody keeps underestimating China. Their space programs started with second hand copies of Soyuz capsules, and now runs circles around the US Space program...

https://youtu.be/ItLFpYha6Wc?t=1204

Re: China built 10 missile cruisers in 48 months, packing 1,120 missiles

#55
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's empty because they won't attack Taiwan Can you elaborate?

Sure. The US has a treaty to defend Taiwan against foreign aggression. China has abstained from attacking the Taiwanese people since before I was born. Ergo, you are the only one who thinks China is stupid enough to behave in a nonsensical manner.

> The US has a treaty to defend Taiwan against foreign aggression.

The US does not have any such treaty. First off, the US doesn't have any treaties with Taiwan, because the US does not recognize Taiwan as a country. What the US has is its own national law, the Taiwan Relations Act, which is deliberately ambiguous as to whether the US would actually intervene to defend Taiwan.

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