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'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

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Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#91

Post by hkt »

kettleballroll wrote: post #72
roughly wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire point of this is that productivity does not go down in a 4 day workweek and retention goes up. As an employer, you get the same amount of output, happier employees, and better retention. Everyone says they’re a data driven business until the data tells them something they don’t believe.

> The entire point of this is that productivity does not go down in a 4 day workweek Just an anecdote, but: my productivity definitely took a huge hit when I reduced my hours to 4days/week. All of the "working harder/more efficiently/more focused" doesn't help if you already worked hard/efficiently/focused. If you have a job with a lot of slack/downtime/waiting time... Sure. But sometimes, working 20% less means that…

This is why people also talk about retention.

Personally I'd think of the extra day as rent paid on not having to hire and onboard someone new.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#92

Post by globular-toast »

Xenoamorphous wrote: post #85

I find it odd that everyone here is talking about productivity. Although I guess it's to be expected since posts about increasing productivity are popular in HN; lots of people here focusing on their careers I suppose. Personally I find we work way too many hours. We spend the good part of 5 days a week (if we're lucky) at work, often literally all the daylight hours, at least in winter. I have to take my daughter ve…

People spend all their lives doing pointless work, accumulating wealth, then have nothing to spend it on so buy something like a car they don't need (like an SUV).

It's odd there aren't more people questioning this. Wouldn't they rather enjoy their lives while they're young and not worry about having tons of disposable income when they're old?

I guess there's something about security that drives people to the latter. Also I feel like there's an addiction and/or conditioning element to it. I think people are scared of what will happen if certain people (thick people) no longer have to work. What will they do during the day etc?

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#93

Post by firesteelrain »

flax wrote: post #24
firefoxd wrote: post #21

Last Sunday, I was walking down the street with my kids when a man bumped into me trying to cross the street. He turned around to apologize and we had a discussion at the red light. He was working a 12 hour shift and was now on his break which he had to rush to get to the store. He said memorial weekend was extremely busy. "After that we will go back to regular busy." When we talk about 4 day workweek, it's for some…

You don't have to have individuals working 24/7 to have things open 24/7.

Meaning more employees and then more overhead.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#94

Post by firesteelrain »

trashface wrote: post #20

Kind of wish employers would use this to hire more people to get additional productivity. But they probably won't do that, which shows how strong their inclination is to only retain employees that meet established preferences. Treating healthcare as a benefit (as in the US) also works against expanding employment, as its a large fixed cost per employee that can't really be reduced.

Hiring more employees costs money.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#95

Post by MattPalmer1086 »

mrmincent wrote: post #71

4 days a week is great. I’ve dropped down to 4 days work (4x8hours paid), and look after my son one day a week. My wife has switched to doing compounded hours on 4 days (4x10hrs paid) and looks after our son on another day. We both get close to an extra 2 months a year with our son, which is phenomenal. One thing I wouldn’t recommend is having a Wednesday off - it’s what I’ve had to do, and I find it a big interrupti…

It depends. My brother worked a 4 day week when he had his daughter, same reasons as you. He loved taking Wednesday off, since he never had more than 2 consecutive days in the office He really doesn't like offices...

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#96

Post by card_zero »

globular-toast wrote: post #92
Xenoamorphous wrote: post #85

I find it odd that everyone here is talking about productivity. Although I guess it's to be expected since posts about increasing productivity are popular in HN; lots of people here focusing on their careers I suppose. Personally I find we work way too many hours. We spend the good part of 5 days a week (if we're lucky) at work, often literally all the daylight hours, at least in winter. I have to take my daughter ve…

People spend all their lives doing pointless work, accumulating wealth, then have nothing to spend it on so buy something like a car they don't need (like an SUV). It's odd there aren't more people questioning this. Wouldn't they rather enjoy their lives while they're young and not worry about having tons of disposable income when they're old? I guess there's something about security that drives people to the latter.…

Henry Ford claimed his motivation for instituting the five-day week was so that people would want to go out driving on their newly available Saturdays, and buy a Ford for their leisure time. Which is some weird voodoo when you think about it. Produce extreme volumes, lower margins, lower production (per worker) and increase demand - huh?

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#97

Post by _glass »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #89

When I was nomadding around SE Asia, I worked 5 hours a day, 6 days a week (so I had time to do all the cool stuff in the places I was travelling through). That worked really well - I was at least as productive as I normally am in a standard 40-hour week. A decade ago I was working 5 days a week from an open-plan office, and mentally clocked out around 2pm each day. Office culture meant I was just moistening a chair…

I was nomadding in Istanbul, working 4h per day, whenever I wanted to. This was the perfect setup. Unfortunately, as one gets older the classical developer role is not really possible anymore. Now I work 8 to 9 hours, 2 days in the office per week, 3 days at home. While it is better than the normal 9 to 5, quality of life really suffers. But I think it is mostly about that the 4 hours I could do whenever I wanted without human contact, just deploy and make it work. Now I have more of a management lead role. Maybe I should switch back to pure development... But I am afraid, because I saw it, at least in Germany, this means it is going downhill career-wise with age.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#98

Post by unsigner »

Let me offer an intentionally shocking counterpoint:

The 4-day workweek only appears possible due to the peace divident, and the peace is rapidly coming to an end. We'll need the fifth, and maybe the sixth day of the week to produce shells, missiles, trucks, tanks, ships, planes, and to make up for the lost productivity of those who are on the battlefield.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#99

Post by thworp »

esafak wrote: post #10

I wonder if productivity is ever going to increase to the point where we work one day a week.

Not without a drop in living standard, no. If you're good with what was normal in the 1950s, we easily could. This will obviously keep going, in about 2060 you will probably be able to afford a 2020s standard of living on one day of work.

Re: 'It's better for humans in general': The 4-day workweek is closer than you think

#100

Post by _glass »

metabro wrote: post #57

I’ve been working 4 days a week informally for a decade. Everyone checks out on Fridays with the exception of the rare fire. I suspect it’s the same for other information workers.

When I was working in consulting this was so unfair. I as a developer was hacking away on Fridays, while the rest was relaxing.
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