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Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

bbc.co.uk

61–70 of 99 posts

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to elaborate on what you mean by "mentally exhausted"?

Physically I felt great. Mentally it was like I had spent a long day memorizing pi numbers, or spent the day in an ice cream store while willfully resisting the temptation to eat any of it. Hard to put into words, basically like there was a part of me, specifically something like the part responsible for will and motivation that desperately needed rest.

In theory, it should be pretty easy to lab test the effects of lucid dreaming on various parts of the brain. In your case, the regions associated with willpower, executive function, etc. (prefrontal cortex, primarily). You could do sleep studies and fMRI studies of brain regions, both after waking from normal sleep cycles and after waking from lucid dreaming.

Call me highly skeptical that there are any neurological benefits to lucid dreaming. In fact, I'm inclined to believe that intentionally inducing lucid dreams, night after night, is going to have a serious net-detrimental effect on health by way of disrupting sleep cycles.

Sleep serves a lot of very finely tuned purposes for the brain and the body, not the least of which is mental "garbage collection."

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#62
One of the few times I'm actually qualified to comment on an article. Top comment by tokenadult has it all wrong. Sure you can do Wake Back to Bed ones or mess up your sleep cycle to do it but you certainly don't have to. I never did I lucid dream several times a week. It's much easier to just keep a dream journal and do realit checks while you're awake.

Second, there's no need for piles of studies on lucid dreaming. I never feel tired or anything like that after I have big lucid dreams. The opposite in fact. After a particularly emotional or powerful dream I feel alive! I feel exuberant and it's easier for me to get out of bed. It's a fantastic way to practice skills as well. I'm an MMA fighter and I have many many fighting dreams that feel perfectly fluid and natural. The pathways in my brain for fighting are being stimulated for hours at a time while I sleep. Sure it's not 1:1 with real life practice but the opponents in my dreams often do novel moves I have never been exposed to before and I have to come up with novel counter techniques. It's clear to me that lucid dreaming practice is helpful to real world skills.

Not to mention the entertainment value. My favorite most recent one was telekinetic powers. I made forks and knives fly across the room then when I wanted to test out more power I looked out the window and made a nice car sized chunk of earth come rippping out of the ground. It was fucking awesome.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#63

I've heard a lot of claims about lucid dreaming among some young people I know well locally (some of whom post here from time to time). I don't get the impression that lucid dreaming is really as beneficial as they think it is. Some cases I know about from personal observation involve disturbing sleep cycles so much in pursuit of lucid dreams that the young people failed in work environments or crashed and burned in…

I tried lucid dreaming and it was quite easy for me to control my dreams. But after I woke up, despite the fact that I had slept 8+ hours, I felt mentally exhausted. Physically I was fine, no yawning or anything, but mentally I felt like I hadn't slept. It was a weird disassociation of physical vs mental exhaustion. I've tried it a few times and it's the same every time. To me the slightly more fun lucid dreams are n…

I tried lucid dreaming a few years ago. Initially, the main problem that I was having was to wake up as soon as I realized I was in the middle of a dream. It took me almost no time to go back to sleep but I "was missing" the dream every time I woke up.

After a few days, I was able to control most of my dreams. I never had full control of those (there was a moment where something got out of control) but I liked the experience. I think the best experience I had dreaming was flying.

In any case, I always woke up fully rested (which might have to do with not being able to control it 100%).

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#64
post #22

I practiced becoming lucid in dreams. This was a about five years ago. I was able to do it on a regular basis. I loved it. One of the greatest benefits was solving my 'day' problems in my sleep. Of course, it was fun and surreal. One of the side effects was sleep paralysis. Eventually, I realized my energy level was dropping. Lucid dreaming was taking my rest away. I stopped. I prefer to let my body sleep normally no…

Have you ever opened your eyes during a sleep paralysis incident? I did it once and what happened was so scary that I always close my eyes and let it pass from then on.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#65

I've heard a lot of claims about lucid dreaming among some young people I know well locally (some of whom post here from time to time). I don't get the impression that lucid dreaming is really as beneficial as they think it is. Some cases I know about from personal observation involve disturbing sleep cycles so much in pursuit of lucid dreams that the young people failed in work environments or crashed and burned in…

"Some cases I know about from personal observation involve disturbing sleep cycles so much in pursuit of lucid dreams that the young people failed in work environments or crashed and burned in their university studies."

That is laughable ignorance my friend. The Wake Back To Bed method might mess your sleep schedule up a little, but you're only supposed to be up for about 30 minutes or so then you go back to sleep. That's not even the most common way of lucid dreaming. To say people have ruined their lives trying to lucid dream is, frankly, completely ridiculous and I'm embarrassed for the HN community for upvoting this post.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#66

While I've had a few "lucid" dreams in my life that I can remember, I'm skeptical of anyone who claims they can do this with some regularity. Don't forget, there's a comparable number of people who claim the ability to "astral travel". When you wake up in the morning, how can you tell whether you were lucid dreaming or just dreaming that you were lucid dreaming? I don't mean that distinction as a joke; in one case yo…

LaBerge proved that people can have lucid dreams at will as part of his doctoral research at Stanford. Even if you haven't mastered the at-will inductions like MILD or WILD (see Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming by LaBerge or consult Google), you can increase your frequency of lucid dreams (once or twice a week for me in my third year of high school) by using critical state testing, which practitioners of Tibetan dream yoga have supposedly been doing for hundreds of years. The idea is twofold.

First, it's usually very easy to tell if you're dreaming. If you're sober and you even have to think about whether you're dreaming then you can safely say you are. That's hard for some people to do, so you might want to use a more tangible method. If you pinch your nose and try to breathe through it, you will be able to breathe in almost all dreams (you can never 100% prove awakeness, but we only care about proving asleepness), and you will never be able to breathe if you're awake. So if you find you can breathe through a pinched nose, you know you're dreaming. If you don't want to pinch your nose in public all the time, you could look at your hand instead. Count the number of fingers and ask yourself if they are straight or deformed. The dreaming mind is really bad about accurately generating five-fingered realistic hands, but we never notice unless we deliberately look at our hands in a dream. This method is almost as surefire as the nose method.

The second part of the method is that if you make it a habit to check to see if you're dreaming whenever a certain kind of event comes up, let's say whenever you walk through a doorway, that behavior will carry over to your dreams once it has become a habit. Once you walk through a doorway in your dream, you will do the nose or hand test and discover that you're dreaming. It's fine to be skeptical of science when it sounds too good to be true, but seriously give it a try. Lucid dreaming is a lot of fun, and there are also a lot of practical benefits. One that comes to mind is being able to literally work out problems in your sleep. It's sometimes hard to keep text constant on a dream whiteboard, but you have the advantage of being able to manipulate text with the snap of your fingers--something that you can't even do yet with vim or emacs. Another advantage of lucid dreaming is nutrition and weight loss. It's a lot easier to say no to that piece of cake now if you'll have the opportunity to eat it while you sleep. Dream food tastes about the same as real food.

P.S. The experience of astral projection (in the sense of having a highly real-feeling dream in which you can roll out of your physical body and walk around your room, which looks virtually identical to how it does in real life) is actually a real phenomenon that's rather easy to induce using a variation of wake-initiated lucid dreaming (WILD). The vast majority of people who claim to achieve this are telling the truth. While there is no reason to accept the non-scientific explanation that they're actually leaving their body in some astral plane in real life, the actual experience they're reporting is very real.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Physically I felt great. Mentally it was like I had spent a long day memorizing pi numbers, or spent the day in an ice cream store while willfully resisting the temptation to eat any of it. Hard to put into words, basically like there was a part of me, specifically something like the part responsible for will and motivation that desperately needed rest.

In theory, it should be pretty easy to lab test the effects of lucid dreaming on various parts of the brain. In your case, the regions associated with willpower, executive function, etc. (prefrontal cortex, primarily). You could do sleep studies and fMRI studies of brain regions, both after waking from normal sleep cycles and after waking from lucid dreaming. Call me highly skeptical that there are any neurological b…

Highly skeptical is not what I'd call you. Overly skeptical is what I'd call you. I've been LD'ing for 4+ years now. I feel more refreshed and less groggy after a fun lucid dream. Every time. I know several other veteran dreamers and they say the same thing. None of us do the WBTB, we just go lucid in the middle of the dream. Sleep is a finely tuned process but you dream every night whether you remember it or not so lucid dreaming is not disrupting anything. It just gives you an awesome amount of control over

I swear, reading through these posts is super frustrating. It's like everyone who can't/hasn't lucid dreamt before is actively discouraging others from trying it because they're jealous/scared or something.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In theory, it should be pretty easy to lab test the effects of lucid dreaming on various parts of the brain. In your case, the regions associated with willpower, executive function, etc. (prefrontal cortex, primarily). You could do sleep studies and fMRI studies of brain regions, both after waking from normal sleep cycles and after waking from lucid dreaming. Call me highly skeptical that there are any neurological b…

Highly skeptical is not what I'd call you. Overly skeptical is what I'd call you. I've been LD'ing for 4+ years now. I feel more refreshed and less groggy after a fun lucid dream. Every time. I know several other veteran dreamers and they say the same thing. None of us do the WBTB, we just go lucid in the middle of the dream. Sleep is a finely tuned process but you dream every night whether you remember it or not so…

I am not making anything up. If it works for you great. It did not do anything for me.

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#69
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Don't forget, there's a comparable number of people who claim the ability to "astral travel". That is a rather uncompelling argument. How many people claim to be able to do something has very little to do with whether or not that thing is possible. Many, many people claim to have been helped by homeopathic remedies, and none of them have. Relatively few people claim to be able to walk on their hands, but many of the…

Pretty much any time I've become aware in a dream that I am dreaming, I wake up immediately. The one dream that I remember where I suddenly realized I was dreaming but didn't wake up went pretty awry. I became very confused in the dream trying to figure out if I was awake or not. It was disturbing.

>Pretty much any time I've become aware in a dream that I am dreaming, I wake up immediately.

Most, but not all of my experiences have been similar, although I actually suspect that in at least some cases I have not actually woken up, but have merely dreamt that I woke up. At one point I "woke up" from a lucid dream to find myself in bed in the middle of the night, went back to sleep, and then was awoken moments later by my alarm and found that the sun was fully risen. Not conclusive, as I may have just slept dreamlessly in the interim (although that's uncommon after waking from a dream and going back to sleep), but suspicious.

Another time, I woke up immediately after realizing I was dreaming, looked around my room, and found that my dream had persisted and was visually composited over the real world around me. This was, of course, extremely disconcerting, and my solution was to close my eyes and go back to sleep. But looking back, it seems far more likely that I dreamt that entire experience, including the waking up and looking around, than that my brain actually had that kind of catastrophic system failure.

In any case, losing your grasp on lucid dreams is a common and frustrating problem, and people have gathered a few tricks for holding on. One that has sometimes worked for me is, when I feel things beginning to slip, rather than panicking, to spin gently in place with my eyes closed (although closing your eyes in a dream is not always

Re: Lucid dreaming: Rise of a nocturnal hobby

#70
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fghh45sdfhr3, what did you dream lucidly? When I could control my dreams I would probably just stop whatever my brain is trying to figure out and start a sex dream.

Flying, building a great world - much like creative Minecraft 10 years before it was invented. And yeah sex too, but that kept waking me up.

Fellow lucid dreamer here. I've tried some explorations of the interface between sleep and waking from within dreams. In my experience/opinion, sex dreams might tend to break up because they use the tactile sense a lot and vision not so much. That can lead to inadvertently paying attention/letting-in one's real-body proprioceptive sense channel or attempting to give motor commands out to one's real muscles (rather than sticking with the dream-sense channels and the more expectation-based moment to moment control of one's dream).
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