Live data from Hacker News

Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

thedrive.com

141–150 of 198 posts

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#141
Yet another reason why I'm not a fan of modern cars. The trend is going against the consumer. I recently had to spend $1200 to replace a headlight because my car was designed so that it's impossible to perform such a simple repair without dropping the front end, using custom equipment. Any attempt to go through a third party or do it yourself will cause significant damage to the front end that will cost more to repair.

The amount of spying and protectionism built into these cars makes me uncomfortable with owning one. While there are manufacturers like Aptera who are claiming to want to buck this trend by offering mail-order replacement parts, I'm convinced that I should just weld together my own rolling chassis and build a modern electric horseless carriage. It's insurance and safety concerns that give me pause. People in my state drive like maniacs on the best of days. A home built car, regardless of how much over-engineering I put into it, will likely be less safe in a collision than a modern car.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#142
post #139

This is exactly why I bought a car that has a fuse for the Data Communication Module (DCM) that I have pulled, and I will never buy another car unless I can physically disconnect anything in it that sends radio transmissions.

In my case I can’t drive my car then because the RF also handles the location beacon which is required for the class 3 alarm system which is needed for the insurance. Without insurance you can’t drive. So there are many situations where unfortunately this is not an option.

I can see where an insurance company would want a beacon if they're covering your risk of theft, but that's not the mandatory part of insurance.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#143
post #130
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you have to do is stay just under the radar without looking like you're staying under the radar. The Amish stand out. But mc32 driving a 1998 Volvo with no cell phone does not stand out.

> But mc32 driving a 1998 Volvo with no cell phone does not stand out. What is "mc32"?

The original poster (assumed non-Amish).

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#144

To take the counterpoint to most comments on this topic: It used to be impractical to track cars to fine granularity. Now that it is practical: maybe we want that? Cars are multi-ton, incredibly-expensive pieces of hardware that operate on shared roadways. There are about 42,000 deaths related to operating them each year. Increased tracking would simplify the challenges of * Finding stolen vehicles * Discovering the…

This same sequence of thought can be applied to a wide variety of things. In particular, "think of the children" is always effective.

So as an absurd example: perhaps there is a net societal good in not treating a house with children in it as a private space? Most children are abused by their parents or other close relatives - shouldn't we want to protect children from their abusers?

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#145
post #139

This is exactly why I bought a car that has a fuse for the Data Communication Module (DCM) that I have pulled, and I will never buy another car unless I can physically disconnect anything in it that sends radio transmissions.

In my case I can’t drive my car then because the RF also handles the location beacon which is required for the class 3 alarm system which is needed for the insurance. Without insurance you can’t drive. So there are many situations where unfortunately this is not an option.

Sounds like the problem is the insurance company.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#146
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's illegal about removing the fuse for the OnStar system from your own car? Certainly the doctrine of first sale applies here?

On late model Toyotas, pulling the fuse for the DCM (Data Communication Module - component that sends nonconsensual telemetry back to Toyota) also disables the car's bluetooth microphone and front right speaker. There is a procedure to disable the DCM and restore at least the speaker, but it involves partial disassembly of the dashboard.

So disconnect the antenna, and for bonus marks connect a dummy load in its place.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#147
post #139

This is exactly why I bought a car that has a fuse for the Data Communication Module (DCM) that I have pulled, and I will never buy another car unless I can physically disconnect anything in it that sends radio transmissions.

In my case I can’t drive my car then because the RF also handles the location beacon which is required for the class 3 alarm system which is needed for the insurance. Without insurance you can’t drive. So there are many situations where unfortunately this is not an option.

I don't live in the US but when the insurance wanted my car "lo-jacked" I just changed to a different insurance company, it's still a choice.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#148
post #4

There is a growing number of cases where the salesperson will activate OnStar (or a non-GM equivalent) without asking or telling the buyer about it. As far as I know, there is no (legal) way to deactivate OnStar or similar GPS trackers built into cars. Of course if you're driving in a city the proliferation of ALPRs is so pervasive that your movements are being tracked in real-time even if you're driving a 1958 Ford…

I thought there was some way the police can disable your engine via onstar.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#149

Your location isn't that big a deal. They can easily get that from License Plate Readers. What will be interesting, is if they ever use the data to give you tickets. I know that there was a discussion of a plan to use the New Jersey Turnpike tollbooths/EZ-Pass to judge speed between two points, and mail you a ticket. I don't think it ever made it out of the starting gate.

I thought in france, your entry and exit times were logged on tollways and tickets would be issued if the distance/time was too high.

Re: Carmakers Will Give Your Location to Police Without a Warrant, Senators Say

#150
post #49
post #48

Makes me wonder how this case remains unsolved. (Or if solved, unreported.) https://cwbchicago.com/2024/05/bucktown-hit-and-run-bentley-...

That looks like a ~2005 Bentley Continental which may not the ability to call home.

I somehow imagine any automation in a bentley or rolls being made of finely machined brass cogs and clocksprings. Maybe a sextant for location services.
Post reply on HN