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The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

theguardian.com

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Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#31

Post by marvin »

GJim wrote: post #16
AlexandrB wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US leaving your baby unsupervised is likely to result in someone calling CPS and a bunch of trouble for you. So while the chance of having your child kidnapped is vanishingly small, there are enough busybodies who believe the chance is high to result in the same net effect: you can't leave your baby unattended.

That's a problem due to the American peoples acceptance of authoritarian policing; something that would be inconceivable in more enlightened countries.

Norway’s child protective services has 17 convictions against themselves and counting in the International Human Rights Court of Strasbourg.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#32

Post by spython »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #18
GJim wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a problem due to the American peoples acceptance of authoritarian policing; something that would be inconceivable in more enlightened countries.

In Germany you are arrested for home schooling. Different cultures have their flaws.

Why would that be considered a flaw? The rationale behind it is the same as behind the inability to name your child XAe or any random assortment of letters – to not make the future difficult for your child, even if you as a parent might want it. It is also one of the last tools that prevents parallel societies from forming. Not that German schools are ideal - they are a bit stuck in the past - but the common experience they create in each new generation is valuable.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#33

Post by tossandthrow »

coreyh14444 wrote: post #2

American in Denmark here: Yes, this is exactly right. The article covers a lot of topics but does a good job for the most part. The only thing not mentioned from HN point of view is that for tech workers, salaries are MUCH lower than in the US. My family's quality of life quotient though is very high. My kids (12, 14) have basically free reign of the city and we don't worry about them at all.

The salary component is interesting. While Denmark definitely has lower salaries than the US, it still has higher salaries than other European countries.

I considered moving to France or the UK, but in both cases I would have to take serious salary reductions. Anecdotally, I know that Tesla Berlin hire SWEs at around 60k EUR. Offers from Norway and Sweden have been considerably below what the Danish unions report as average salary.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#36

Post by yau8edq12i »

indeed30 wrote: post #19
bilbo0s wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Denmark? Culturally homogeneous? I'm not sure you've actually been to Denmark. Culturally homogeneous is not what I would call it.

I'm interested in what you're comparing against. Denmark is typically towards the bottom of any measure of cultural or ethnic diversity - e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_ranked_by_et... I have been to Denmark many times and it strikes me as considerably more homogenous than the UK or the US.

It's funny how little time it takes to go from "cultural" to "ethnic". Say what you think instead of using whistles: you think that Denmark conforms to your racially focused worldview, that it's "pure", or whatever. Am I correct?

Funnily enough, Denmark is a few places below France in "ethnic fractionalization", yet somehow, racists worldwide insist that France has become a shithole because of immigration.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#37

Post by bilbo0s »

AlexandrB wrote: post #13
koolba wrote: post #11

> Adults who trust each other not to steal babies go on to trust one another around older children playing unsupervised. Such delusion to think we could have a society where people don’t steal babies the moment they are left unattended. I bet they’re not even worried about a passerby taking candy from them too.

In the US leaving your baby unsupervised is likely to result in someone calling CPS and a bunch of trouble for you. So while the chance of having your child kidnapped is vanishingly small, there are enough busybodies who believe the chance is high to result in the same net effect: you can't leave your baby unattended.

That's just another dimension of the problem.

But let's be honest here, there are a lot of child snatches in the US. About 150 to 160 new reports yearly per 100000 kids. By comparison, Denmark annually reports between 50 to 75 new missing child cases per 100000 children.

(And even that obscures the starkness of the difference. Because in Denmark, they count children abducted to another country by a parent as a missing child if the country they are abducted to is a member of the convention. So you actually have to subtract about 35 to 40 cases per 100000 children from the Denmark numbers to get an apples to apples comparison to the US numbers. I just wanted to present the numbers in a fashion as friendly to your view as possible. And still there is a pretty stark difference.)

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#38

Post by tossandthrow »

jeppester wrote: post #25
coreyh14444 wrote: post #2

American in Denmark here: Yes, this is exactly right. The article covers a lot of topics but does a good job for the most part. The only thing not mentioned from HN point of view is that for tech workers, salaries are MUCH lower than in the US. My family's quality of life quotient though is very high. My kids (12, 14) have basically free reign of the city and we don't worry about them at all.

It has some times been a political theme in Denmark that we have to attract highly skilled workers and how we can do that best. Often the talk has been about for instance giving foreign workers tax exemptions. On those occasions I've often wondered how much of an impact the high trust and high social of safety has - for instance compared to salary. I'd imagine that it plays a big role in making people stay.

This is generally an issue currently in the EU: Countries are stealing talent and letting residents pay. As such I myself exploited NHR in Portugal. But it is possible to both move to Hungary and Holland on tax reduction schemes.

Personally, I hold the belief that these should not exist. They are a race to the bottom only the well educated can participate in.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#39

Post by incomingpain »

I've heard this a few times before. Admittedly I'm not that familiar with Denmark. Lets check out the livability.

GDP is okish; has signs of foreign influence or some sort of financial crisis.

2.5% unemployment is fantastic. 75% participation and steadily climbing, elderly going back to work?

https://www.populationpyramid.net/denmark/2020/

Wow, only 5 million people? Toronto has more people. Though yes elderly going back to work.

Central bank is very healthy.

Interest rates went negative a little bit. Seemingly 0% typically? Hence the elderly going back to work.

Their government didnt print a bunch of money?

~250% private debt to gdp is high, housing crisis?

excellent balance of trade.

!!! government debt to gdp is below 30% holy smokes!

Big boost to military spending

Household debts to gdp below 100%, but not by much. That's ok.

60% housing ownership isnt great. Housing bubble crashing most likely with high private debt to gdp, high rates. Likely priced their own people out of the market; forcing the bubble to crash.

55% personal income tax rate? Yikes! 25% sales tax, 22% corporate tax. Those are some insane taxes.

Re: The Denmark secret: how it became the most trusting country

#40

Post by lucianbr »

inglor_cz wrote: post #7
NotGMan wrote: post #3

[flagged]

Denmark has about the harshest asylum law west of the Oder. Practically zero pull factors, and the total immigration stats reflect that. If Germany copied the relevant Danish law (and the copy survived a subsequent challenge at the Constitutional Court in Karlsruhe), the European migration crisis would be mostly over.

May I ask why you bother to specify the geographical location of the Constitutional Court? I assume you guys don't have several of those. I mean, in general for other countries people just say "constitutional court" and that is it, and it seems to make sense that way. I am curious.
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