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Introducing Copilot+ PCs

blogs.microsoft.com

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Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#171

Post by bibanez »

Dalewyn wrote: post #144
josefresco wrote: post #107

Are these suitable gaming laptops? I run local LLMs (Ollama) using my NVIDIA graphics card but I can't tell if these ARM chips are suitable for gaming.

I hope you realize that most of the gaming world runs on ARM CPUs and iGPUs today. Smartphones and tablets far outnumber gaming PCs.

I intuit parent was referring to PC gaming, which is far more demanding than mobile gaming. Also, most PC games are compiled to x86_64, which means there will need to be a virtualization layer for non-native games (the majority), which will add latency.

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#172

Post by callalex »

tempaccount420 wrote: post #120

40 TOPS is not that impressive, an iPhone 15 Pro has 35 TOPS.

These kind of stats really need a “for 30s” and “for 10m” qualifiers. I strongly suspect that an iPhone will start throttling within seconds of not minutes compared to a laptop with a fan.

(Although there are definitely laptops with fans that still throttle within minutes, and they usually have a fruit on the side of them.)

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#173

Post by pelagicAustral »

isoprophlex wrote: post #124

Their "copilot" brand is so weird and... muddled. There's the AI code assistant thing that github actually started, there's the horrible chatbot maker GUI demoware, there's AI stuff you might be able to do with your sharepoint (if only you could get hold of the right ms sales rep to take your money), there's an app that does genai things on your personal MS account... And now there's a Surface rebrand? That org chart…

See the hellish naming and branding they've done with the .NET ecosystem... It is so convoluted, even people actively developing on their stacks would have and issue figuring out if they are downloading the right stuff.

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#174

Post by DaiPlusPlus »

adastra22 wrote: post #126
TonyTrapp wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And Surface initially was an interactive table (now called PixelSense) before they reused the name for their tablets. Which made it really difficult to find relevant information on developing software for the old Surface after the tablets were announced!

Oh man, what a fail. I loved the idea of the Surface, and was bummed out when they coopted the name for their PC/tablet line, as I assumed that meant the original product was dropped. I had no idea about PixelSense and I could have been a user.

Oblig: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZrr7AZ9nCY

——-

As an aside, when I was at MSFT in Building 40 in 2013 we had a Surface table in the lobby; it never worked as well as the demo videos made it look: the table-top wasn’t glass but had a rough rubberised protector layer on-top that ruined it, the built-in WPF-based demo apps that we played with were all somewhat janky: you’d get 12-15fps not 60fps, touch drag latency was also abysmal, and most of the demo apps’ rendered scenes didn’t use global lighting, so pinch-rotating two objects in different directions would just look bad.

(Pre-teamroom) campus building lobbies were where once-cool hardware goes to die; another building at the other end of campus (where the Direct3D people were) had a widescreen rear-projection TV running Windows Media Center 2005 until well into 2015 IIRC.

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#175

Post by jarjoura »

The coordinated launch of real ARM laptops across 4 different companies, Dell, Lenovo, HP and Samsung is quite an achievement for Microsoft after a decade of failed ARM launches. This seems uniquely different to me because, there is a real and marketable limitation to what you can find in Intel/AMD (the lack of NPU).

Before Microsoft pushed ARM as an option for "all day battery power" however, the huuuuuge tradeoff was compatibility with your existing tools and very underwhelming performance.

However, can I just complain for a moment?! Why are these laptops shipping with fixed options at exactly 1TB of storage and only 16 GB of memory with no way to specify different configurations? So with all this cross-company coordination and opportunity for eyeballs on this renewed ARM push, they still felt the timid 16 GB would be more than enough to generate excitement?

Yes, yes, I know, it's fine for a generic office product, but am I the only one who is thinking this is a red flag, and this is going to be just another failed launch and huge missed opportunity at wider ARM adoption?

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#176

Post by [deleted] »

isoprophlex wrote: post #124

Their "copilot" brand is so weird and... muddled. There's the AI code assistant thing that github actually started, there's the horrible chatbot maker GUI demoware, there's AI stuff you might be able to do with your sharepoint (if only you could get hold of the right ms sales rep to take your money), there's an app that does genai things on your personal MS account... And now there's a Surface rebrand? That org chart…

[deleted]

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#177

Post by udp »

chatmasta wrote: post #168
isoprophlex wrote: post #124

Their "copilot" brand is so weird and... muddled. There's the AI code assistant thing that github actually started, there's the horrible chatbot maker GUI demoware, there's AI stuff you might be able to do with your sharepoint (if only you could get hold of the right ms sales rep to take your money), there's an app that does genai things on your personal MS account... And now there's a Surface rebrand? That org chart…

Their first co-pilot (which still exists) was about pairing a second Xbox controller to your console.

Ah but is that the Xbox 1, the Xbox One, the Xbox One X or the Xbox Series X?

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#178

Post by EvanAnderson »

isoprophlex wrote: post #124

Their "copilot" brand is so weird and... muddled. There's the AI code assistant thing that github actually started, there's the horrible chatbot maker GUI demoware, there's AI stuff you might be able to do with your sharepoint (if only you could get hold of the right ms sales rep to take your money), there's an app that does genai things on your personal MS account... And now there's a Surface rebrand? That org chart…

> Their "copilot" brand is so weird and... muddled.

Microsoft can't brand anything cleanly and unambiguously.

"MSN Messenger" / "Windows Messenger" / "Windows Live Messenger" / "Microsoft Lync"

"Internet Explorer" / "Windows Explorer" / "MSN Explorer"

Windows 95 email client "Exchange" / email server platform "Exchange"

"Outlook" / "Outlook Web Access" / "Outlook Web App" / "Outlook.com" / "new Outlook for Windows"

"Microsoft Teams" / "New Microsoft Teams"

"Office Communicator" / "Microsoft Lync" / "Skype for Business" / "Skype" / "Skype for Business Online" / "Skype for Business for Microsoft 365"

The most guffaw-inducing branding, to me, was the recently-announced remote desktop client called "Windows App". That's going to be an easy one for users to search for.

(For guffaw-inducing I suppose there's also the Windows 98-era "Critical Update Notification Tool"[0])

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Update#Critical_Update...

(Edit: Yikes. I didn't even consider .NET. Windows.NET server. .NET Framework. ASP.NET. .NET Core. Ugh...)

More editing because I can't stop myself:

"Great Plains" / "Navision" / "Solomon" / "Axapta" / "Dynamics AX" / "Dynamics GP" / "Dynamics SL" / "Dynamics NAV" / "Dynamics 365" / "Dynamics 365 for Finance and Operations" / "Dynamics 365 Business Central"

More editing because I was egged-on... >smile"Windows Defender" / "Microsoft Defender" / "Windows Defender Antivirus" / "Windows Firewall" / "Windows Defender Firewall" / "Microsoft AntiSpyware" / "Microsoft Security Essentials" / "System Center Endpoint Protection"

Oh, ugh... then there's the whole "Microsoft Proxy" / "Forefront" / "Federated Identity Manager" nightmare.

Then there's "System Management Server" / "System Center" and that whole train of products.

Edit: Forgot SharePoint

"Microsoft FrontPage" / "Site Server" / "Site Server Commerce Edition" / "Office Server" / "SharePoint Portal Server" / "Windows SharePoint Services" / "Microsoft Office SharePoint Server" / "SharePoint Foundation" / "SharePoint Server" / "SharePoint Standard" / "SharePoint Enterprise" / "SharePoint Online" / "SharePoint Designer"

Re: Introducing Copilot+ PCs

#179

Post by voiceblue »

udp wrote: post #177
chatmasta wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their first co-pilot (which still exists) was about pairing a second Xbox controller to your console.

Ah but is that the Xbox 1, the Xbox One, the Xbox One X or the Xbox Series X?

This is the naming convention you get when you hire engineers based off of “edit distance” Leetcode problems.
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