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Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

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Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#51
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you replicate that SQLite DB onto other hosts to achieve redundancy?

One could use Litestream [1] [1]: https://litestream.io

What if a continuous replication system has a bug one day, and you realize you are just a bit corrupted and have to rerun? Or is it the same with cloud tools?

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#52

Does no one ever delete data? It's hard to believe there's much business value in keeping every individual payment record dating back to 2017.

It might just be an internal policy to cover all the crazy combinations of regs the world over. They might just say 10/20/100 years is their policy, now figure out how to store it.

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#53

The original[1][2] articles are a better read IMO. The link is just a summary of the two with added spelling and grammatical errors that materially impact the meaning. 1. https://www.uber.com/blog/how-ledgerstore-supports-trillions... 2. https://www.uber.com/blog/migrating-from-dynamodb-to-ledgers...

Seems to happen with all our blog posts that appear on here (I work at Uber) - I don't get why the originals don't get upvoted but these rehashes do - are our titles just not as good?

> I don't get why the originals don't get upvoted

Because they were never submitted? I looked for the first one, it doesn't seem to be on HN.

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#54

Congrats to anyone who worked on it! However, I'm guessing the cost of just running this team be quite large and not significantly different from the savings (6M), and add on top of it the overhead of maintenance. Payments would not likely be a long-term bet as well, so kind of interesting why teams take up such projects ? Is it some kind of sunk-cost with the engineering teams you already have?

> I'm guessing the cost of just running this team be quite large and not significantly different from the savings (6M), and add on top of it the overhead of maintenance I'm guessing they know a lot about their costs, and you know very little. There's little value in insulting the team members like this.

That was not a nice reply for a non-insult. Do you have anything to add maybe?

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#55
post #38

Congrats to anyone who worked on it! However, I'm guessing the cost of just running this team be quite large and not significantly different from the savings (6M), and add on top of it the overhead of maintenance. Payments would not likely be a long-term bet as well, so kind of interesting why teams take up such projects ? Is it some kind of sunk-cost with the engineering teams you already have?

At one end of the spectrum, some people here claim to write this kind of software over a weekend. Some others claim they require a salary of $600,000, and still need nine additional colleagues to pull something like this off. There is a lot of room in between, where cost estimates are more realistic.

This answer pretty much sums a lot of my experience. Of course when the guy somehow pulls this off in 2 weeks it is seen as an easy side project with proof that it is, haha

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#56

I’m working on a specialized data store[1] that would be perfect for this kind of use case (large “cold” storage with indexing). But I’m having trouble finding potential customers. I’ve tried Google search ads but got 99% spam and 1% potential investors, but 0% potential customers. If anybody has any ideas I’m all ears. 1. https://www.haystackdb.dev/

Besides all the other good feedback here, I will offer my extremely petty reason why I wouldn't spend much time evaluating this product. In the FAQ, under the "Are transactions fully ACID?" heading, there is a typo: "simultaineously". It gives me the impression that not enough care has gone into an important part of this product. I know it's not a fair jugdgement, but first impressions matter.

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#57
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given 30.7TB SSD’s are about $5500 each and you’d need 56 to to get to 1.7PB (with no redundancy). Not to mention that SQLite’s maximum DB size is 140TB. I don’t think you’d be able to fit this much storage into a single machine, especially not for a few thousand a month and SQLite wouldn’t be appropriate for this use-case.

If you install a RAID controller and a couple of disk boxes, it's possible with 1:1 replication, or with backups. 60 disk 3.5" units already exist, so 2.5" SSD racks. It won't be cheap, but will be resilient and fast. Bloody fast if you have the budget.

> or with backups take a while to restore a PB and a way to take a hot backup without impacting the service that by itself is a task or snapshots which is more disk

> 1:1 replication Depending on the amount of writes could be a ton of extra disk and a bucket for network cost

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#58
post #28

Is this another outlier when you reach certain scale, it’s more beneficial to roll your own? Pretty amazing what Uber has to deal with. Also it’s not very clear from the original articles, what is the new total “cost of ownership” of this new refactored service. Like now they need to manage their own databases and the storage backing them. Or did i miss it?

I worked for a company which used Redis at the prototyping phase, but then wrote own database to improve performance and resilience. The company wasn't selling an end-user facing product, the product was a distributed filesystem.

My take on this is that most companies don't have the expertise to build systems like databases, and even if the costs would otherwise suggest such a development as desirable would be simply afraid of doing it.

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#59

I’m working on a specialized data store[1] that would be perfect for this kind of use case (large “cold” storage with indexing). But I’m having trouble finding potential customers. I’ve tried Google search ads but got 99% spam and 1% potential investors, but 0% potential customers. If anybody has any ideas I’m all ears. 1. https://www.haystackdb.dev/

Some B2B and B2B2C products just don't work with walk-in leads. You need someone to create and chase down a set of leads.

Re: Migrating Uber's ledger data from DynamoDB to LedgerStore

#60

Does no one ever delete data? It's hard to believe there's much business value in keeping every individual payment record dating back to 2017.

Payment information is often subject to pretty strict regulatory requirements, including archival durations. Having to keep all the original information for 10 years is not entirely uncommon.
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