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Stuck due to “knowing too much”

programmers.stackexchange.com

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Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#61

Post by sklivvz1971 »

geophile wrote: post #27

Some lessons in software engineering take a long, long time to sink in. (For me, at least): - Don't generalize too early, which seems to address the original question pretty directly. - Don't optimize too early. - Maintainable > Correct > Fast. Maintainable = comprehensible. If it isn't maintainable, you won't know if it's correct. If it isn't correct, there's no point in making it fast. - Minimize state. Deriving so…

The phrase you may be looking for: do all that stuff at the "last responsible moment".

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#62

Post by fennecfoxen »

spolsky wrote: post #50
frankc wrote: post #7

The moderation on programmers.stackexchange.com is completely overbearing. How can a question about analysis paralysis be closed for off-topic? If stackoverflow is for technical question/answer, what is the point the linked stackexchange if not for discussion of a common programmer problem like this? I see stuff like this closed all time time and it's really annoying.

This is a rambling discussion, which Stack Exchange is not really intended for. There are lots of good places to have rambling discussions. We focus on answerable questions with specific answers, not long-winded, open-ended conversation starters. There are plenty of other sites for long-winded, open-ended conversation starters, including Reddit and Hacker News. After a decade or so of operating sites for programmers…

If there's a meta.stackoverflow.com, have you considered some sort of socialization.stackoverflow.com? Then you can not only say "buzz off" but specifically give someone a place to buzz off to. It'd be one of those pragmatic concessions that keeps the idealism moving along and whatnot :)

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#63

Post by randomdata »

michael_fine wrote: post #44
frankc wrote: post #7

The moderation on programmers.stackexchange.com is completely overbearing. How can a question about analysis paralysis be closed for off-topic? If stackoverflow is for technical question/answer, what is the point the linked stackexchange if not for discussion of a common programmer problem like this? I see stuff like this closed all time time and it's really annoying.

It's really frustrating how they keep doing this. Their users are begging, literally fighting with the mods over this, and they still don't allow it. If they are opposed to diluting the technical questions there, why don't they just make an programmer opinion stack exchange site? This reminds me of the founding of Adobe, when Steve Jobs told them what he wanted, as did two other companied, and the refused, saying "We…

I have never really used StackOverflow, so from just a casual observer's point of view: It seems that allowing discussions would deviate the site into another commodity forum (there are already hundreds on the topic of programming), at which point they've lost their marketplace edge. I suspect they are trying to protect against that.

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#64

Post by praptak »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #62
spolsky wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a rambling discussion, which Stack Exchange is not really intended for. There are lots of good places to have rambling discussions. We focus on answerable questions with specific answers, not long-winded, open-ended conversation starters. There are plenty of other sites for long-winded, open-ended conversation starters, including Reddit and Hacker News. After a decade or so of operating sites for programmers…

If there's a meta.stackoverflow.com, have you considered some sort of socialization.stackoverflow.com? Then you can not only say "buzz off" but specifically give someone a place to buzz off to. It'd be one of those pragmatic concessions that keeps the idealism moving along and whatnot :)

Intentionally or not, Programmers is the de facto "buzz off" site for StackOverflow.

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#65

Post by JohnMcG »

spolsky wrote: post #50
frankc wrote: post #7

The moderation on programmers.stackexchange.com is completely overbearing. How can a question about analysis paralysis be closed for off-topic? If stackoverflow is for technical question/answer, what is the point the linked stackexchange if not for discussion of a common programmer problem like this? I see stuff like this closed all time time and it's really annoying.

This is a rambling discussion, which Stack Exchange is not really intended for. There are lots of good places to have rambling discussions. We focus on answerable questions with specific answers, not long-winded, open-ended conversation starters. There are plenty of other sites for long-winded, open-ended conversation starters, including Reddit and Hacker News. After a decade or so of operating sites for programmers…

What percentage of closed questions are translated to one of the above bullet points?

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#66

Post by JohnMcG »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #62
spolsky wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a rambling discussion, which Stack Exchange is not really intended for. There are lots of good places to have rambling discussions. We focus on answerable questions with specific answers, not long-winded, open-ended conversation starters. There are plenty of other sites for long-winded, open-ended conversation starters, including Reddit and Hacker News. After a decade or so of operating sites for programmers…

If there's a meta.stackoverflow.com, have you considered some sort of socialization.stackoverflow.com? Then you can not only say "buzz off" but specifically give someone a place to buzz off to. It'd be one of those pragmatic concessions that keeps the idealism moving along and whatnot :)

Well, it was, but now the moderation there is even more draconian.

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#68

Post by yrizos »

frankc wrote: post #7

The moderation on programmers.stackexchange.com is completely overbearing. How can a question about analysis paralysis be closed for off-topic? If stackoverflow is for technical question/answer, what is the point the linked stackexchange if not for discussion of a common programmer problem like this? I see stuff like this closed all time time and it's really annoying.

Hey frankc! You're right Analysis paralysis is on topic on Programmers, the question however is not constructive, in the Stack Exchange sense. The close reason was a bit misleading (now changed), but at the end of the day closed means closed.

As to why it is not constructive: We don't like discussions. Ok, that's a lie, we love discussions, especially heated flamewars, after all we are programmers. However we haven't yet found a good way of moderating and curating such questions on Stack Exchange, we have an array of excellent tools at our disposal, none of which was designed with free flowing open ended discussions in mind.

This is more of a "it's not you, it's us" problem and it's a discussion we seem to be having at least once a week but the bottom line is, open ended free flowing discussions don't work on the platform, and unfortunately we have to close them.

Feel free to bring up any issues you have with Programmers on Meta, especially when it's about closed questions. Sometimes all it takes is a small edit to make the question a bit more focused for it to be re-opened...

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#69

Post by yrizos »

praptak wrote: post #59
yrizos wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you really now what Programmers is about ;) "What kind of fabric is best for covering programmers' chairs?" would be closed in seconds...

I was being sarcastic. Front page, scored +5: "Is hiring a “chief intern” a good idea?" . Answerable with specific answers? Not really. Edit: Another one, +28 votes, front page: "Is there a viable alternative to the agile philosophy?" . I'm not making this up.

Hm... The titles seem awful, but at least the "Is hiring a “chief intern” a good idea?" one has a very specific set of parameters. It can be answerable with specific answers, and sufficiently answered by a very small set of answers. That said, the answers so far are...

The "Is there a viable alternative to the agile philosophy?" one is from Nov 2010, a more relaxed era, when the site's scope wasn't as well defined as it is today. It was bumped on the front page by a minor edit (argh). I'm on the fence on this one, and I'd prefer it be closed by five regular users.

Re: Stuck due to “knowing too much”

#70

Post by yrizos »

JohnMcG wrote: post #66
fennecfoxen wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there's a meta.stackoverflow.com, have you considered some sort of socialization.stackoverflow.com? Then you can not only say "buzz off" but specifically give someone a place to buzz off to. It'd be one of those pragmatic concessions that keeps the idealism moving along and whatnot :)

Well, it was, but now the moderation there is even more draconian.

Hey, thanks for noticing!
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