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How to get 7th graders to smoke

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Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#191

Post by foobarchu »

dwhitney wrote: post #168

Contrarian view - the programs are working. Rates of smoking among teens over the past three decades: Ever used nicotine: 70.1% in 1991 to 17.8% in 2021; Occasional use of nicotine: 27.5% in 1991 to 3.8% in 2021; Frequent use of nicotine: 12.7% to 0.7%; Daily use of nicotine: 9.8% in 1991 to 0.6% in 2021 https://www.fau.edu/newsdesk/articles/teen-cigarette-smoking... I suspect the same can be said for workplace sexua…

I think that can be chalked up to other changes like the wild increases in cigarette prices, the near elimination of advertising, and cigarettes becoming culturally uncool (orthogonal to DAREs attempts). Your link shows that during the heyday of these campaigns usage rates were still rising. They didn't really drop until after the approach was dialed back, and they dropped most appreciably after DARE gave up on anti-drug messages entirely.

The message of the article wasn't that you can't discourage drug use at all, it's that the means may be counterproductive. The means used in DARE were counterproductive.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#192

Post by Atotalnoob »

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #173
Atotalnoob wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hate the “LSD is safe” mantra people have. I had a college roommate who did a shit ton of LSD one night and I woke up to the fire alarm having been pulled and him punching holes in the wall. The police (fire department called the police) dragged him off and the hospital had to give him a bunch of antidepressants to short circuit the LSD. He was literally not the same person ever again. That is terrifying, ev…

Literally not the same as in personality change or as in unable to stick to reality after?

Huge personality shift

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#193

Post by fatnoah »

patwolf wrote: post #22

This brought back memories of the D.A.R.E. officer coming to my elementary classroom to give us the "don't do drugs" speech. At the end of the speech with feigning hesitation he'd pull out the drug briefcase to the cheers of the kids, like a band holding out their best song for the encore. "This here is methamphetamine, aka crystal meth or speed. If you see a man running down the street with the strength of a bear, t…

I've probably said this in other posts, but the best "don't do drugs" education my child got was living in a city. It's one thing to hear about drugs, it's another to watch your dad call 911 for a man collapsed with a needle still in his arm in a subway headhouse doorway.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#194

Post by syang737 »

knowaveragejoe wrote: post #175
dwhitney wrote: post #168

Contrarian view - the programs are working. Rates of smoking among teens over the past three decades: Ever used nicotine: 70.1% in 1991 to 17.8% in 2021; Occasional use of nicotine: 27.5% in 1991 to 3.8% in 2021; Frequent use of nicotine: 12.7% to 0.7%; Daily use of nicotine: 9.8% in 1991 to 0.6% in 2021 https://www.fau.edu/newsdesk/articles/teen-cigarette-smoking... I suspect the same can be said for workplace sexua…

This isn't contrarian, this is just correct and well understood. What's contrarian is the article suggesting that any attempts to change people's behavior, no matter how well intentioned thought-out, actually result in the opposite of the desired outcome.

While the statement "kids are smoking less cigarettes" is correct, not sure if that's proof that the programs are working. Naturally, teens are filling the void of cigarettes with vapes and e-cigs, seeing as 26% of high school students (https://www.singlecare.com/blog/news/vaping-statistics/) have vaped.

Whether the programs are working or not is more of a debate, but don't want this cherry picked stat to go untouched.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#195

Post by [deleted] »

throwaway22032 wrote: post #167
Atotalnoob wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hate the “LSD is safe” mantra people have. I had a college roommate who did a shit ton of LSD one night and I woke up to the fire alarm having been pulled and him punching holes in the wall. The police (fire department called the police) dragged him off and the hospital had to give him a bunch of antidepressants to short circuit the LSD. He was literally not the same person ever again. That is terrifying, ev…

I don't understand how anyone who has ever taken LSD can say that it's safe. Maybe at low doses. Once you can't seperate fantasy from reality you're just one bad trip from falling out of a window you thought was a door. edit: The responses here just seem like denialism from people who got lucky to be honest. You can be aware that you are tripping and still imagine that something is something else. Roads looked like f…

[deleted]

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#196

Post by quickthrowman »

jandrese wrote: post #177
throwaway22032 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand how anyone who has ever taken LSD can say that it's safe. Maybe at low doses. Once you can't seperate fantasy from reality you're just one bad trip from falling out of a window you thought was a door. edit: The responses here just seem like denialism from people who got lucky to be honest. You can be aware that you are tripping and still imagine that something is something else. Roads looked like f…

One rumor I've seen is that dealers have been replacing LSD with NBOM which has a significantly higher chance of causing a psychotic break and is harder to safely dose. This gets back to the big problem with illegal drugs isn't the drugs, it the illegal.

Ehrlich’s reagent can be used to test for the presence of an income, NBOMe, 25I, and related compounds will not show up as an indole.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#197

Post by [deleted] »

[deleted] wrote: post #195
throwaway22032 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand how anyone who has ever taken LSD can say that it's safe. Maybe at low doses. Once you can't seperate fantasy from reality you're just one bad trip from falling out of a window you thought was a door. edit: The responses here just seem like denialism from people who got lucky to be honest. You can be aware that you are tripping and still imagine that something is something else. Roads looked like f…

[deleted]

[deleted]

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#198

Post by hollywood_court »

bongodongobob wrote: post #115
parpfish wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

people start out wanting to smoke for whatever reason, but then the addiction kicks in and you just keep smoking even after that reason has passed. among adult smokers, i've always wondered what the breakdown was between people that actively like smoking and want it in their lives versus those that are ambivalent but quitting is too much of a hassle?

I'm a smoker and everyone I know who smokes hates it but it's just so fucking hard to quit. It takes active energy for months and months not to do it.

I suggest using shame to leverage yourself into quitting. It's fallen out of favor in our society, but shame really should be a powerful motivator.

I used it to quit smoking tobacco, quit drinking, and quit a 20+ habitual marijuana habit. I use shame to make myself do that extra bit of work in the evenings after my family has gone off to bed. Shame has plenty of good uses if leveraged properly.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#199

Post by amadeuspagel »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #125
amadeuspagel wrote: post #9

The main reason that it's hard to change people is that they resist manipulation. This is hard to see if you only consider well-meaning attempts to change people, which you might not consider manipulation because that word has a negative connotation.

> The main reason that it's hard to change people is that they resist manipulation. This seems flat out wrong to me given how extremely difficult it is for most people to change themselves . I guess on some level you could argue that people are "manipulating" themselves, but that seems a bit silly to me given how you are using the word manipulation. It's hard to change people because humans are actually great at mult…

Not at all. The fact that it's hard to change yourself is itself part of the resistance against manipulation. It's a second layer of defense. Even if someone is able to manipulate your explicit beliefs, they still aren't able to manipulate your behaviour.

Re: How to get 7th graders to smoke

#200

Post by Dylan16807 »

pxc wrote: post #180
vkou wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people regularly 'overdosed' on heroin by throwing up and feeling like shit for a day, with the same kind of survival rate that drinkers 'overdose' at, opioids wouldn't be killing tens of thousands of people a year. Alcohol abuse either kills people in the long term, or combined with automobiles. Very few people have a bit too much to drink some night and actually die from it. You'll generally black out long befor…

Yes, heroin overdose is much more often fatal than alcohol overdose. (That doesn't change what the word 'overdose' means. If you want to be more specific than the word is, feel free to use adjectives, e.g., 'fatal overdose', 'deadly overdose', etc.)

In common practice, people use 'overdose' to mean life-threatening overdose.
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