Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

lesswrong.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 111 posts

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#61

Post by t_akosuke »

vasco wrote: post #32
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

> You may find yourself having to learn to think in a new way literally. I've said for a few years now my personality is slightly different when I speak English. I have a partner of several years that doesn't speak my language nor me hers and we communicate in English and even simple things like expressing affection feel different even after a decade. At some point since I speak more English every day than my own lan…

I thought that was a pretty common thing to feel? I mean, the different personality thing. I had never thought about things not feeling so real... I'm gonna definitely meditate on that one for a while I also got sad when i started replacing my native language with English in my thoughts, and pushed myself to think in Spanish again, have more Spanish speakers around me etc. since i no longer live where i learned my native language, i speak a somewhat "foreign" to myself version of it, which introduced a new type of sadness - that of not being recognised as a local in your own home, losing a specific kind of personality that's bound to a specific place- but that's one I've learned to live with

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#62

Post by t_akosuke »

pawelwentpawel wrote: post #42
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

Once you learn, how do you maintain the language? I'm currently in Brazil speaking Portuguese a lot. I used to speak more Spanish. Right now, if I want to switch back to Spanish it takes me a lot of time. They're so similar I still keep on mixing them up quite often. I even started a small project ( https://glot.space ) to try to keep training vocabulary in two languages at the same time to keep the distinction in my…

It is hard when they are such close languages! But maintaining is always hard. I compare it to building with clay while it's mildly raining. You need to keep re building chunks that fall off what you've built. Eventually some chunks dry enough that they are solid forever and you use them as a base to keep going. I don't think you need to put a lot of time and effort in maintenance but you do have to put some with certain regularity

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#63

Post by t_akosuke »

Some of my generic tricks for language learning are:

-don't just lock in on one learning app or method but always be open to find better tools. Every language has different options. But don't waste too much time on that either - that's the language equivalent of trying every JS framework before starting your personal website

-identify what the hard and the easy bits of the language are. Ask yourself which of those you absolutely need in order to progress and which can wait. Then tackle the low hanging fruit while you start nibbling at the hard-but-necessary ones and leave the hard-but-less-necessary ones for later - by which time they will be easier because you'll be more familiar with them. Your perception of what the hard and the easy parts of the language are will evolve with time, stay open to that.

-adding to the last point, identify your strengths and weaknesses towards the language, this includes understanding what advantages your current stock of languages give you. Like, how Japanese pronunciation is easy for a Spanish speaker, but vocabulary acquisition isn't. Or how if you have very good memory but poor social skills you'll be good at building your vocabulary but speaking will require extra effort.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#64

Post by barrell »

ix101 wrote: post #27
__experiment__ wrote: post #16

i have learned many language (german, english, french, japanese, korean). i have used Anki, Supermemo, Flashcards, Watched Series, Read Books and the only thing that seems to work is: - Spaced Repetition - Something you actually enjoy(learning should be fun) - Comprehensible Input anything else has not worked for me.

The limitation with flashcards is that you get the entire answer, not sure if there are flashcard apps with a hint function? I experimented with vocab training where you can peek the first two letters which helps jog the memory.

There’s a hint function on phrasing.app :) we’re launching the public beta this week sometime

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#65

Post by emporas »

pard68 wrote: post #45

Barring English, I only speak "dead" languages. Am I a polyglot still? Latin, Koine & Classic Greek, ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and am at "coffee" level in a few ANE/Semitic languages.

Sanskrit is an important one IMO. I have tried to learn sanskrit in the past, didn't manage to do so, too few resources.

Dead languages, might not be dead for very long, machines do better in grammar and syntax nowadays.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#66

Post by barrell »

pawelwentpawel wrote: post #42
zerof1l wrote: post #21

I'm currently actively learning my 5th language and passively learning the 6th one. There's no universal way to learn a new language. What works for one doesn't work for another. Also, a big factor in how hard it will be to learn a new language are the languages you know already. If the new language is similar to the one you know already, i.e. is in the same language family, you will have a much easier time learning…

Once you learn, how do you maintain the language? I'm currently in Brazil speaking Portuguese a lot. I used to speak more Spanish. Right now, if I want to switch back to Spanish it takes me a lot of time. They're so similar I still keep on mixing them up quite often. I even started a small project ( https://glot.space ) to try to keep training vocabulary in two languages at the same time to keep the distinction in my…

I’m working on phrasing.app partially to solve this problem. My solutions are:

- study flashcards from l3 l4 to cut down on time - practice switching between the languages and distinguishing between them (I use interleaved flashcards on phrasing) - have a really painless audio review (to get a lot of your reviews done quickly) - listen to input every now and then (tv, podcast, something). A little bit every now and then goes a long way

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#68

Post by mycologos »

jll29 wrote: post #2

I would suggest to drop "Amateur" from the title in the sense that languages are useful both professionally and privately - you never know in what language your next deal will be signed, your next networking acqaintance bumps into you to make you the next job offer etc. Besides, as a professional (computational) linguist, I have met many trained/professional linguists that know only one language - typically English -…

> I would suggest to drop "Amateur" from the title in the sense that languages are useful both professionally and privately - you never know in what language your next deal will be signed, your next networking acqaintance bumps into you to make you the next job offer etc

I agree that knowing more languages can only help, but it's an awfully large time investment for that hypothetical benefit. Unless you're moving to a place or in love with a person that speaks it, learning a language seems pretty far down the list of time-efficient ways to improve your "professional and private" life. That's not to say people shouldn't pursue it, as hobbies go it seems like an edifying one, but unless you think it's fun, it doesn't seem very worth it.

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#69

Post by golemiprague »

fromMars wrote: post #48
cicloid wrote: post #23

I speak Spanish and English, but then I moved on to Japanese and now find myself stuck. I'm not confident in any scenario involving Japanese. Perhaps I should explore other languages (likely French, Portuguese, or another Romance language), then revisit Japanese. From there, I might transition to Mandarin and Korean. Either the path I chose is too complex, or age is beginning to impact my cognitive speed. Has anyone…

East Asian Languages are tough for Westerners, or at least that has been my experience. The biggest problem is really the barrier to reading especially with Chinese and a lesser extent Japanese. Would love any tips from someone who has mastered all those characters without full immersion or a structured University curriculum.

[dead]

Re: Becoming an Amateur Polyglot

#70

Post by uolmir »

ix101 wrote: post #33
deanc wrote: post #22

> Learn only 4 tenses. Past for one time events, past continuous, present, future. These are enough to go by and explain yourself. There is no future tense in Finnish. Or gendered personal pronouns. Oh and there’s about a gazillion words for snow. And god help you if you need to articulate that your spruce is returning.

On the subject of tenses Turkish has a "reported past tense" which I haven't heard in other languages so far. It's very commonly used and simply denotes that someone told you of something that happened. I.e. you didn't witness / weren't present.

You may enjoy this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evidentiality

As an English speaker myself it's astonishing the number and range of features that other languages have built in, so to speak. Years ago I took Latin and the idea of declension just blew my mind. And that's basic in the grand scheme.

Post reply on HN