Earlier quoted context omitted.
as someone who’s also autism adjacent and content with it, let’s still recognize that it’s not called spectrum for nothing. Yes, one’s norm of "functioning" can be more dependent on society than you’re own opinion, but I’ve witnessed several individuals on the "lower functioning" end of the spectrum who really didn’t seem like they were content with the way they’re living life. I’m not infallible, but it definitely s…
At minimum we should center such people in these discussions rather than talk about them with pity or only when using them to advance a rhetorical point. I want to hear from people with the highest support needs on this issue the most.
Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
301–310 of 358 posts
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#302Earlier quoted context omitted.
At minimum we should center such people in these discussions rather than talk about them with pity or only when using them to advance a rhetorical point. I want to hear from people with the highest support needs on this issue the most.
The ones with the highest support needs are non-verbal, so that's going to be tricky.
Here is some literature for you to learn more about autism, particularly how to communicate with nonverbal people: https://www.healthpolicypartnership.com/reimagining-communic...
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#303Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then people should stop conflating the two. This whole "spectrum" nonsense is nonsense. Your coworkers are not autistic - they are weird or whatever other more PC term you might want to use, and that's great - many, if not most, great engineers are!. There is no need to pathologize differences in people. Your relative, by contrast, is. If you have a habit of feeling sleepy at work, it's not like we say you're on the…
I got my autism diagnosis in my early 20s (from a licensed psychologist, before you ask). It was a life-changing experience for me. Suddenly I was able to understand and validate my experiences and shortcomings, and to improve myself based on that understanding, instead of resigning myself to the fact that I’ll always just be a ‘weird’ human with ‘weird’ opinions, feelings and experiences. I suppose though that since…
It's always the same game with pseudo sciences. It appeals to our biases or desires, which results in enough people turning off their skepticism (because they like or agree with what they hear) to let it perpetuate itself. In astrology no issue or problem was of your own nature or doing, it was merely because the stars were not aligned. That has gradually transitioned to being replaced by because you have this psychological classification, or that.
You are still the exact same weird person you were before the diagnoses, and you always will be. And that's perfectly normal, so to speak. The declining trend of real, and deep relations, in the West seems to have left many people failing to understand something. Everybody is weird. If you think somebody is "normal", that simply means you don't know them well enough. And weak autism diagnoses and treatment in modern times seems increasingly geared towards pushing people towards arguably undesirable traits (such as excessive emotiveness) while doing away with many traits and characteristics (such as singular focus, minimal susceptibility to emotionality, or obsessive attention to detail) that are highly beneficial for leading a productive and successful life.
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#304>suramin They're investigating the use of a drug that they don't understand to treat a condition that they don't understand, through the lens of one model that variously competes with or incompletely conforms to a myriad of other models of the condition. In order to what? Nebulously "manage" a complex neurological difference that will always defy reversion to anything else? It sounds like they want something that the…
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#305Earlier quoted context omitted.
> On the other hand, if "prevention" is about culling the gene pool, I'm dead set against that. Well, you can be against it by raising autistic children yourself, it seems you're in a perfect position for that. Why people feel they have the right to demand that from others is beyond me.
The problem is that when you teach society that a certain “kind” of person needs to be culled, that is a stigma about people in that group. IME such strong feelings don’t don’t stay relegated to your personal choices, they get reflected at a broader policy level. People say “well it was your choice to have such broken people, we gave you a pill that would make that not possible. Therefore we las a society will not su…
They say it’s basically the holocaust because you’re exterminating deaf people by curing them. Do you support their views?
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#306Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have a diagnosis, i just dont trust doctors. please stop gaslighting me
You gaslighted yourself by claiming you don't have ADHD/aspergers anymore. The only explanation is that you either never had it, which is closer to what you said or that you still have it, which is ignoring what you said.
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#307I know of at least one book written by and for autistic people who advocates for a gluten free diet. They claim in the book that this significantly reduces their symptoms. I don’t know if I believe it or not, but the notion of gut-brain axis seems to imply that a good diet should help a bit, right?
I didn’t really know whether to believe it, but the effect that minerals have on the human body seems to suggest that the right mineral should help a bit, right?
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#308Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was only responding in kind. And I'm autistic myself, so. Honestly, the only hostility toward austitic people I see around here is the person invalidating and ignoring the opinions of others within the autistic community.
I’m not invalidating opinions from autistic people tho, I said many times autistic voices should be centered. When I typed what I had said before about not seeing any different opinions here from autistic people it was not because I was ignoring your opinion but because I had not seen it. Your opinion is valid. However I don’t honk you were only responding in kind in your last reply — the poster was simply asking a q…
They were not simply asking a question - in that case, they could've dropped the second part, which had exactly the same implication as my sarcastic reply.
Anyway...
> are you not worried that such efforts will further stigmatize autistic people as in need of a cure without ever actually offering one?
No, I'm not, because I don't see them as being mutually exclusive. We can do research to understand the causes of ASD and other neurodivergence - and hopefully eventually offer options for those of us who don't like to live with it - and still work toward destigmatizing it and making society less problematic for people like us. We've been doing that for decades at this point.
I would also note that you're only considering outward pressure on autistic individuals - that is, you're focusing on how difficult it is for us to live in society. But that is only one part of what autism is. Even if society were perfectly accepting of us and there were no obstacles at all in it, I'd still be overstimulated by the sound of rain, or have a meltdown because I can't get away from a smell, or... There are various "internal" symptoms that no amount of destigmatization will ever get rid of.
I'll also point out that, maybe the reason you don't encounter many autistic people who want to be "cured", is because people like you - who so strongly oppose such research - make us feel like traitors to our kind, and so we just shut up about it, and feel isolated even from the one community who we shouldn't feel isolated from.
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#309Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then people should stop conflating the two. This whole "spectrum" nonsense is nonsense. Your coworkers are not autistic - they are weird or whatever other more PC term you might want to use, and that's great - many, if not most, great engineers are!. There is no need to pathologize differences in people. Your relative, by contrast, is. If you have a habit of feeling sleepy at work, it's not like we say you're on the…
There’s this thing people online tend to do where they’ll take a well-defined word or phrase like autism spectrum disorder and just decide that it actually should mean something else and get mad when everyone else uses the word in the “wrong” way. It consistently derails conversations, and it almost never brings anyone around to a place of greater understanding.
According to the CDC we're now up to about 3% of kids being "identified" as autistic. [1] In 2010 it was about half as many (per capita). And then in 2004 it was about half as many again. At this rate one can reasonably speak of a majority in the future. Which is quite silly. One of the main differences between a science and a pseudo-science is falsifiability. If an oncologist diagnoses you have a malignant tumor - this is falsifiable. It is either true, or false. You don't need a consensus or an opinion.
But in psychology, there is scarcely such a thing as falsifiability, especially in the overly broad diagnostics. This applies not only to diagnostic/analytical psychology, but even to contemporary research in psychology. Psychology is the butt of the replication crisis with even leading psychological journals seeing replication rates in the twenties. There's something very wrong with this field, and it can be largely explained by considering the fact that it may simply be a pseudo-science.
Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins
#310Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m not invalidating opinions from autistic people tho, I said many times autistic voices should be centered. When I typed what I had said before about not seeing any different opinions here from autistic people it was not because I was ignoring your opinion but because I had not seen it. Your opinion is valid. However I don’t honk you were only responding in kind in your last reply — the poster was simply asking a q…
> the poster was simply asking a question and you replied with sarcasm. They were not simply asking a question - in that case, they could've dropped the second part, which had exactly the same implication as my sarcastic reply. Anyway... > are you not worried that such efforts will further stigmatize autistic people as in need of a cure without ever actually offering one? No, I'm not, because I don't see them as bein…
The intended implication was that the typical "parents of" Facebook group does not count as an autistic community. In my experience, the alleged "autistic community" has always turned out to be something of that nature, but I've only found that out after a lengthy back-and-forth. I phrased the question how I did, because I've found that being more direct puts people on the defensive (more likely to lie), and being less direct doesn't get an answer (less likely to give relevant details). You are the first person I've spoken to who has responded affirmatively.
If I had intended to imply that you were acting in bad faith, I would have dropped the first question, consulted the news guidelines, deleted my entire comment, downvoted yours, and then moved on with my life. I did not.
I apologise for how it came across, but this is one of those fake apologies because I really don't know how I could've done better.
> I'll also point out that, maybe the reason you don't encounter many autistic people who want to be "cured", is because people like you - who so strongly oppose such research - make us feel like traitors to our kind, and so we just shut up about it, and feel isolated even from the one community who we shouldn't feel isolated from.
Eugenics is a wonderful idea that of course we should be doing. However, history suggests that humans cannot be trusted with eugenics. Most autistic people, no matter how worldly, no matter how cynical, just don't get how large groups of predominantly-neurotypical humans behave. You know that innate sense of right and wrong you (likely) have? The closest thing (most) neurotypicals have is a sense of honour, and… well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honour is not the same thing.
Most people only care about doing the right thing if other people would find out, or if people they personally know and care about would be affected, would they do the wrong thing. For a good while, the prevailing academic thought considered autistic morality as evidence of an autistic deficit in theory-of-mind: autistic people clearly don't understand that they're allowed to do wrong stuff whenever nobody could ever find out! (I've lost the paper I learned this from, but https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4834434/ describes autists as having "atypical inflexibility in morality" – which is damning enough.)
We cannot trust most people, but academia is at its core about distributing knowledge (or "knowledge") as far and as wide as possible. The people most likely to act on this kind of research most immediately are organisations like Autism Speaks, who prioritise stamping out autists over the welfare of actual people. (Exercise: compare Autism Speaks' genetics research budget to their marketing/"outreach" budget. Compare that to their torture-"therapy" budget for trying to coerce masking behaviours out of three-year-olds. Now compare that to the money they actually spend on helping actual people live their own lives.)
No matter how much we want the outcome, we have to fix society before we try to research things like this. And I have no idea how we can fix society enough that we can do eugenics without… well, without https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_eugenics.
The ultimate goal of the eugenicist is to eliminate the people who are not like them. This is how it has always been. No matter how they dress it up in smiles and sunshine and roses, this is the beginning and end of their goals.
It is only safe to research eugenics when these people have no power, and there is no expectation of them ever getting power again. (I fear we may never get there, but that sentiment will be a self-fulfilling prophecy, so I continue to act as though things will be better within my lifetime.)
That's why we have the taboo. Hopefully this information helps you talk about your feelings without triggering the taboo. You are right that you should not feel isolated for the way you feel. (I expect that, among the most vocal enforcers of the taboo, are those who feel the same things you do, and for whom pride in their identity forms part of a coping mechanism.) I hope that it is not anybody's intention to exclude you for disliking your own inability to process certain stimuli.