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Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

medicalxpress.com

131–140 of 358 posts

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a spectrum, autism presents in many ways, but it's all considered "autism" at this point. There are not different "kinds". Sometimes "severe" autism at an early age calms down as a person grows. Sometimes "mild" autism gets worse as someone becomes dysregulated and overstimulated. Many times autism is missed in women and POC because they mask more readily than boys. Sometimes it's missed in boys because it's expla…

I don’t see why POC would mask this easier

[deleted]

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#132
post #3

Actual paper: https://www.nature.com/articles/s42003-024-06102-y

So there is a clear result found and then post hoc there is an explanation made for why this makes sense. That's a bit of a red flag since you preferably hypothesize first, but let's look at the analysis. If I'm not mistaken, then these are the most important parts:

- 467 measured metabolites (features)

- 136 males and 69 females = 205 (data points)

- "To minimize overfitting, only correlations with q values Then the predictive performance in Fig. 3 looks very promising with a 0.88 AUC score. However, according to the methods: "Classifiers of 4–7 metabolites were selected and tested for diagnostic accuracy using area under the receiver operator characteristic curve and random forest analysis."

Then, those AUC scores do not provide so much value since they first used the data to select the best features and then used the same data to fit the model on the best features.

It also looks a bit like the authors have thrown the kitchen sink at these 200 samples since I see R, GraphPad Prism, Python, CIRCOS, Cytoscape, and MetaboAnalyst being used.

And the statement "Fifty (50) random samples at each subsample size were taken to estimate the population statistics based on the central limit theorem." is a bit weird because the central limit theorem shows up throughout many analyses including confidence intervals.

So all in all I'm not 100% sure, but I am skeptical. Anyone here who knows more about "Metabolic network and hub-and-spoke analysis" or "network growth" analysis? Or why it is reasonable to use so many metrics instead of being more selective?

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about people diagnosed before the age of 5, they're almost all cases of severe autism. That's very different from the kind of autism you're talking about. People who are permanently unable to live independently have a condition that should be prevented if possible.

As a spectrum, autism presents in many ways, but it's all considered "autism" at this point. There are not different "kinds". Sometimes "severe" autism at an early age calms down as a person grows. Sometimes "mild" autism gets worse as someone becomes dysregulated and overstimulated. Many times autism is missed in women and POC because they mask more readily than boys. Sometimes it's missed in boys because it's expla…

Why not ask autistic people

Have you ever even seen someone with severe autism?

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#135

Used to have a mix of what could be considered ADHD/light asperbergers. I dont eat carbs and mostly stick to a keto diet, it resolved many symptoms. Our food is poison

> what could be considered ADHD/light asperbergers could be considered, or did you get a diagnosis from a specialist? Self diagnosis is not reliable. If you don't have an official diagnosis you can't be certain you really have ADHD. There may be several differe tfactors relevant for YOU that make keto diet work for you. Same diet can be harmful for similar people who have ADHD.

If you knew anything about how "diagnosis from specialist" works in practice you wouldn't dismiss self dismiss diagnosis so easily. "The specialist" usually spend a few hours at most on the diagnosis (if even that) while people who self diagnose live with the symptoms their whole life.

It would be such an easy world of you could go to a doctor and get answers but it's not the world we live in unless it's common cold (and even then a lot of doctors can't be bothered and prescribe antibiotics just in case).

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a spectrum, autism presents in many ways, but it's all considered "autism" at this point. There are not different "kinds". Sometimes "severe" autism at an early age calms down as a person grows. Sometimes "mild" autism gets worse as someone becomes dysregulated and overstimulated. Many times autism is missed in women and POC because they mask more readily than boys. Sometimes it's missed in boys because it's expla…

I don’t see why POC would mask this easier

IIRC it's not really masking, more that children of color are more likely to get labeled "disruptive" or "defiant" than diagnosed as autistic, at least compared to their white peers. Two kids could exhibit the same behavior, but one is correctly recognized as having a meltdown and the other is written off as a troublemaker.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#137
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have microbiome dysbiosis? A keto diet might improve things (eg lower LPS production), but long term can diminish microbial diversity. I’m not saying keto is bad at all - it’s just that microbial diversity is an important predictor in GI health and one should keep an eye on that too.

Yeah i mean i know that keto isnt great, but it has changed my life to some degree. When in ketosis, i feel like i have "agency", otherwise i am this foggy headed, sloth

I can relate to this. Could you point me to any resources about keto diets?

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#138

"Prevention strategies" As an autistic person, no thanks. Let people be autistic.

This is just ridiculous, just like some deaf people wanting their kids to be deaf to be part of the deaf community.

We were born with ears for a reason, same thing, our brains are to a huge percentage built for social skills for a reason.

We can call them however we want but all these are basically diseases of various forms.

People can choose their hair color, to grow their nails long, their clothes or the myriad other things that allow us to express our uniqueness, without making life stupidly difficult for no reason when it's already super hard.

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#139
post #4

I feel like this is going to be used by pseudo-science influencers to push trendy diets to prevent autism when this study is observations stage at best.

Those people often link to papers that directly contradict the claims they make, assuming no one is going to check them. This won't make a difference.

yea example now there are guys in this comment section claiming keto has cured their adhd/autism. Helped reduce symptoms, sure, but cure? (I've got both of them been on keto, like crazy strict ensuring i was in ketosis every two days type, and it only reduced brain fog personally)

Re: Metabolism of autism reveals developmental origins

#140

I know of at least one book written by and for autistic people who advocates for a gluten free diet. They claim in the book that this significantly reduces their symptoms. I don’t know if I believe it or not, but the notion of gut-brain axis seems to imply that a good diet should help a bit, right?

Gluten-free only makes a difference for those with an intolerance. Source: I am HF-ASD, my wife is gluten intolerant so my gluten intake is sporadic but bingey, gluten does nothing at all to me.

The only food that is objectively bad for every single human is processed food. Gluten tends to be processed, so people who needlessly go gluten-free may be incorrectly attributing improvements to that.

Also: if you're not actually intolerant, there is a high chance you're eating gluten without knowing it. Treat yourself to fast food fries? How sure are you that gluten (crumbed chicken) wasn't fried in the oil?

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