Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices • Hacker News Board

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#461

Post by rendall » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:31 AM UTC

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #457

rendall wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can you openly call for the murder of in the US under the protection of the first amendment ? Yes. We see this with open chants of "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" and "Globalize the Intifada" ...as long as the call is not likely to produce "imminent lawless action". Brandenburg v. Ohio was a decision by the Supreme Court establishing the "imminent lawless action" test for determining when speech…

> We see this with open chants of "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" I particularly object to taking worst possible interpretation, and labelling the slogan as a call for ethnic cleansing. The phrase "will be free" would not normally be interpreted this was in in any other conflict.

[flagged]

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#462

Post by Qem » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:31 AM UTC

yonixw wrote: post #426

Qem wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> which turned out to be a Hamas missile Debunked: https://forensic-architecture.org/investigation/israeli-disi... IDF has bombed the entirety of Gaza health infrastructure by now. It's odd they don't want us to believe they would be capable to bomb this particular hospital when they destroyed every single other one.

Did you read it? It says at the end "what happened at al-Ahli remains inconclusive" Not to mention they say they scraped al Jazeera for other incident which is ironic here, because the claim is they misreport And I will add that everything they said is only based on the videos... The impact on the ground was consistent with PIJ/Hamas rockets and not Israel missiles. So I will rather believe U.S. Experts/Western intel…

https://ararmaher.wordpress.com/2024/04/23/doppler-shift-ana...

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#463

Post by reissbaker » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:31 AM UTC

whatshisface wrote: post #302

cjk2 wrote: post #176

Just a point about Al Jazeera that is worth mentioning. There are two Al Jazeeras. One which is presented to Western audiences and one which is presented to Middle-Eastern audiences. The media and articles are politically aligned in each region. Don't assume what you read in the US/UK/wherever is the same as over there. In the case of Israel, the Middle-Eastern unit were literally showing videos demanding further upr…

> Why would you allow that to continue in your country? We have a constitution that protects our rights, and among them a right to make up our minds on the basis of an uncensored discourse. That's the other, implicit half of the first amendment: the right to listen to what others want to tell you.

The U.S. Constitution provides rights for citizens to have free speech — not non-citizens. And in fact, the U.S. does not allow broadcast companies (along with various others, e.g. common carrier and aeronautical radio companies) to be more than 25% owned by foreign entities unless the FCC specifically approves them: https://www.fcc.gov/general/foreign-ownership-rules-and-poli... And for 60+ years the cap was 20%, and you could not go higher: there was no FCC approval process, and the cap was mandated by Congress. (And alternatives like the Internet didn't exist!)

And the E.U. banned Russia's RT media network, and has strict rules over foreign-owned media. This is all just the pot calling the kettle black to score points with anti-Israel domestic audiences. Literally every country complaining about it has some kind of similar restriction. Qatar doesn't recognize Israel as a state and has funded Hamas for years; Israel banning their state-owned media domestically is only controversial because some people find Israel to be controversial. Qatar complaining about it is especially ironic, since they hand out life sentences in prison for criticizing the Qatari government (e.g. Qatari poet Mohammed al-Ajami).

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#464

Post by tptacek » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:32 AM UTC

loceng wrote: post #430

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why not simply negotiate a hostage exchange? Because there are two war aims: hostage release and the removal of Hamas. > Do you expect that if Hamas was about to be completely wiped out, that they would not simply kill all the hostages that were still alive up to that point? No, for the same reason countries don't kill all their prisoners of war right before surrendering. You still need to negotiate the terms of th…

Why do you think that not creating more Hamas isn't also an aim?

There's a distinction to draw between creating more militant opposition to Israel's occupation and creating more Hamas. A category error I think a lot of people make when discussing this is to presume Hamas is a normal representation of armed resistance. At least since 2017, and arguably before, it has been a deeply abnormal armed resistance movement.

You might have reasons to believe that Israel's persecution of Hamas is going to generate a new generation of Hamas, but reasonable people might disagree and say that to the extent Israel is creating new militants, they're likely to look more like Fatah's armed wing than Hamas.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#465

Post by KoftaBob » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:36 AM UTC

Ahmd72 wrote: post #205

cjk2 wrote: post #176

Just a point about Al Jazeera that is worth mentioning. There are two Al Jazeeras. One which is presented to Western audiences and one which is presented to Middle-Eastern audiences. The media and articles are politically aligned in each region. Don't assume what you read in the US/UK/wherever is the same as over there. In the case of Israel, the Middle-Eastern unit were literally showing videos demanding further upr…

Can you point to some articles in Aljazeera Arabic that is doing what you're accusing?

If you want to research yourself, here's the Arabic version of Al Jazeera's Israel-Palestine coverage translated to English:

https://www-aljazeera-net.translate.goog/where/arab/palestin...

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#466

Post by tialaramex » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:39 AM UTC

throwup238 wrote: post #416

suddenexample wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US White House press secretary issued a weak statement condemning Israel's action, but it was on April 1st and the costumed Easter Bunny overshadowed that statement.[7] Wow you can't make this stuff up

Armando Iannucci's career has twice now been upstaged by the increasing ridiculousness of reality in politics. One of the reasons he says he stopped making his first series, The Thick of It, was that UK politicians became parodies of themselves. There was nothing left to make fun of. Then the same thing happened to his American incarnation, Veep.

Iannucci's Death of Stalin has the advantage that it's all history - it can't become more ridiculous after he made the movie because it's in the past. But of course the reality is more or less as absurd as the movie, although different in important ways. (Lots of the timing is completely wrong, events are re-arranged, people are shuffled about so that fewer actors play more important roles) but it does have the advantage that yeah, Stalin can't have another even more ridiculous life which makes the movie seem tame, he's dead.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#467

Post by [deleted] » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:40 AM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#468

Post by JumpCrisscross » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:41 AM UTC

IX-103 wrote: post #455

xenospn wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have a lot of potential political power. They refuse to use it.

"Refuse to use it" like African Americans in the Jim Crow south? Or is there some other context driving their non-participation?

> is there some other context driving their non-participation?

Muslim Israelis have representation in the Knesset. Their community simply hasn’t aligned itself with the American pro-Palestinian movement. (There are absolutely racism issues in Israel. But it’s not Jim Crow.)

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#469

Post by JumpCrisscross » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:43 AM UTC

0xcde4c3db wrote: post #425

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what world efforts are seeking to legitimize Hamas? No real efforts. But a surprising number of young people don't believe Israel has a right to exist.

In my experience, most invocations of Israel's right to exist are not functionally asking people to extend some generally accepted principle to Israel, but rather demanding that they accept Israel's existence as axiomatic. My response is usually something along the lines of "I'm not sure any state has a right to exist, or that it's even a meaningful concept to apply to political entities rather than people". That's o…

> response is usually something along the lines of "I'm not sure any state has a right to exist, or that it's even a meaningful concept to apply to political entities rather than people"

It generally means do they have the rights of a nation-state. That said, I agree it’s a new way of framing the one-state solution.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#470

Post by edanm » Mon, May 06, 2024, 12:43 AM UTC

TacticalCoder wrote: post #259

cjk2 wrote: post #176

Just a point about Al Jazeera that is worth mentioning. There are two Al Jazeeras. One which is presented to Western audiences and one which is presented to Middle-Eastern audiences. The media and articles are politically aligned in each region. Don't assume what you read in the US/UK/wherever is the same as over there. In the case of Israel, the Middle-Eastern unit were literally showing videos demanding further upr…

> In the case of Israel, the Middle-Eastern unit were literally showing videos demanding further uprising against Israel across the region directly from Hamas. > > It's even banned in some Arab countries for being a security risk. > > Why would you allow that to continue in your country? Especially when you have, in your country, about 20% of muslim arabs, most of which being israelo-palestinians ( i.e . palestinians…

Note: The correct word is "Israeli", not "Israelo".

> It's of note that while there about 20% muslims in Israel, there's about zero jewish person in Gaza (there are some israelo-palestinian though) and zero jewish person in Iran. Or close to that.

Actually, while there are ~zero Jewish people in almost all Arab countries, Iran specifically has an actual Jewish population, though a very small one - I think the current estimate is around 8,000.