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MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

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Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#271

Post by dgfitz »

shkkmo wrote: post #185
blueboo wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, the “acknowledge and mark” phrase gets at the statement—That if the org thought objective X was authentic existential goal, it behooves them to understand how an applicant understands and would configure into that plan. (I have no claim about its efficacy. The highly-structured nature of the statement is a head-scratcher. I’m here watching the fallout with everyone else.) I hasten to restate that is my understa…

> it behooves them to understand how an applicant understands and would configure into that plan. I (and a lot of us I think) follow you up to this point, but then you lose us here. How does a written statement, the expected content of which is clearly known, give any understanding of the individual's position? This type of approach to education seems to me that it actively harms the ability to sway people's opinions…

> How does a written statement, the expected content of which is clearly known, give any understanding of the individual's position?

ChatGPT, please write me a DEI statement for this job interview.

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#272

Post by naniwaduni »

shrimp_emoji wrote: post #256
rayiner wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> am very interested in increasing diversity Why? As a non-white immigrant, I’m deeply suspicious of the notion that a team with me on it is in any way different than a team without me on it based on my skin color or ethnicity. I think that line of thinking doesn’t go anywhere good, especially for me, but for everyone else too. As soon as you make it acceptable to say that people are different based on group membersh…

Anyone with a brain and sense of dignity will feel like racism is bad and unfair. Experiencing negative racism is enraging and depressing. Experiencing positive racism instantly gives you impostor syndrome and a sense of dehumanization. The only systems that aren't racist are those that strive to be colorblind (in the sense that we're colorblind to eye or hair color).

> The only systems that aren't racist are those that strive to be colorblind (in the sense that we're colorblind to eye or hair color).

Eye/hair color being a distinguishing feature is mostly a white people thing in its own right...

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#273

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

neltnerb wrote: post #204
whoza wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was on the academic job market recently. I was pleasantly surprised to find that the process of writing my DEI statement was a valuable learning experience. For example, I read several interesting papers about randomized controlled trials testing the effects of various classroom interventions. I also have some more clarity about the relevant philosophical questions, both due to reading others' thoughts and due to b…

Yeah, this is what I am also thinking of. It makes sense for people in a position to create a culture or hire a team to know, it's a science you probably weren't exposed to in school and knowing the real effects that are known and studied is a darn good start to implementing DEI well. Doing it based on guesswork is probably worse than useless. So that's the non-ideological part. If you actually care enough to study i…

> it's a science you probably weren't exposed to in school

Interesting take, why do you think it is you likely weren’t expose to DEI in school?

While I’m thinking about it, didn’t we just used to call it “affirmative action”?

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#274

Post by _lvbh »

Beyond the culture war, I find DEI uncomfortable. I’m not the most articulate and don’t keep up with modern trends. Ask me about computers or tell me to code, but writing about social subjects when I barely leave my room and even then only to exercise feels like a nightmare. I’ve been asked to optionally write something similar during university applications in the past but along with ethnicity and other private information, N/A is the best I can think of.

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#275

Post by MisterBastahrd »

blackhawkC17 wrote: post #11

DEI statements are culty. I see it no different than a religious fundamentalist college asking faculty to sign an oath of allegiance. At least in such a case, you can always know beforehand the BS you'll put up with, unlike secular universities that are adopting DEI statements.

If students uttered a DEI statement every morning in their homeroom classes over the Pledge of Allegiance to a flag, we'd all be in a much better place culturally.

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#277

Post by worik »

resolutebat wrote: post #172
worik wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> see the argument for setting aside seats for people who fluently speak the language. I do not based on race. It is based on culture It is not enough to have genes. And since most Māori people speak English it would simply be stupid to base it on language as that language would be English not Te Reo Māori

Aside: calling the Māori language "Te Reo Māori" in English is unhelpful performative posturing. Yes, that's what the language is called in Māori, but we don't call Chinese "Zhongwen" or 中文.

Untrue

It is what it's called, here, in NZ English

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#278

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

DharmaPolice wrote: post #109
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #81

In the spirit of trying to learn something from the community: while I can certainly understand the rationale and goals behind DEI programs (many of which I agree with, others not), I honestly can't understand these "DEI statements" at all. They always seemed very "1984" to me, and almost designed to engender resentment in a way that would ultimately backfire. So perhaps I'm in a like-minded echo chamber, but is ther…

Not really the same thing but I worked for an organisation which had as a policy that every single team meeting had to have diversity & equality as a recurring item for discussion. 95% of the time this just meant the meeting lead saying "So...diversity - anyone got anything to say?" and then we moved onto the next item after a short silence. But every once in a while someone would raise something that might not have…

It likely wasn’t General Motors you worked at… but every GM meeting must start with a safety tip - or some DEI claim.

In the engineering meetings I can tell you which one happens. And in the executive meetings that certain people can’t wait to spend 5-10 min of probably $20,000 worth of a dozen executives time with their feelings on the matter.

I fondly remember a heated discussion about chainsaw safety techniques.

Re: MIT abandons requirement of DEI statements for hiring and promotions

#280

Post by skissane »

gverrilla wrote: post #268
skissane wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no such a thing as cultural Marxism. That's a conspiracy theory the nazis first created. There is such a thing as "cultural Marxism", and it is not a conspiracy theory invented by the Nazis or anyone else. Consider for example the 1981 book by academic Richard Weiner, "Cultural Marxism and Political Sociology" [0] – it discusses "cultural Marxism" as a real thing, in a positive light, and it is a real acad…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Bolshevism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Marxism_conspiracy_th...

The Nazi concept of "Cultural Bolshevism" has nothing to do with Cultural Marxism the post-war academic movement

"Cultural Marxism conspiracy theory" is about claiming that said post-war academic movement is a "Jewish plot". Yes, that's an antisemitic conspiracy theory. But stating that the academic movement exists, and discussing to what degree its ideas influenced contemporary social movements such as BLM, is not a conspiracy theory, and not per se antisemitic.

I think what is happening here, is some people are motivated to ignore the difference between what is a reasonable argument ("to what degree was a contemporary social movement influenced by a contemporary academic theory") and what is an unreasonable one ("it's a Jewish plot"), because they want to shut down that reasonable argument

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