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Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

theguardian.com

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Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#231

Post by SauciestGNU »

flumpcakes wrote: post #210
sa501428 wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are indeed restrictions on western foreign media. "Like all foreign news organizations operating in Israel, CNN’s Jerusalem bureau is subject to the rules of the Israel Defense Forces’s censor, which dictates subjects that are off-limits for news organizations to cover, and censors articles it deems unfit or unsafe to print. ... the military censor recently restricted eight subjects, including security cabinet…

This seems reasonable to me? If a western press were outside missile factories saying "this is the only place our super missiles are built!" I would expect the department of defence to block that information from being published...

That's unlawful in the United States, whose values Israel purportedly represents. It's called "prior restraint".

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#232

Post by yonixw »

arp242 wrote: post #192
yonixw wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All newspapers get things wrong some of the time. And what if there are no retraction? only if the backlash is big enough? Like in the case where there were no hundreds of dead in a direct bombing but a 50 dead in a failed PIJ rocked on hospital: https://archive.is/r6noB and the same version today: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/10/16/israel-ha...

I can go tit-for-tat with examples from Israeli newspapers or even Israeli government for the rest of the day, but like I said, what matters is the overall pattern and how this compares. And as far as I know, Al Jazeera is not significantly worse here. Also: why are you using two accounts? :-/

> examples from Israeli newspapers ... Al Jazeera is not significantly worse here.

Sure, I would like to see something similar from Haaretz/Ynetnews where they believed Israel without critical due process. And did not retract in a consistent matter.

And the second account is my mobile (I like it separate)... that is why I gave them the same name.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#233

Post by dakom »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #75
dakom wrote: post #69

[flagged]

> Israel is routinely held up to a far far higher standard than any other country Is it held to a higher standard than countries America provides arms to? (Genuine question.) Note: I'm not saying we haven't provided arms to horrible regimes. But it's loudly criticised. Rightly or wrongly, we hold ourselves and our allies to a higher standard than e.g. Iran, China or Russia. It's partly why we have so many more of the…

Yes, in many facets of this war Israel is held to a higher standard than America itself.

When the towers were hit, the gloves came off. America wasn't accused of genocide when civilians were accidentally killed as they went after ISIS. The notion of a news agency reporting on American military strategy and directly inciting an additional attack on American soil in actionable ways wouldn't be tolerated for a second. It's so absurd that there isn't even a real-world comparison, America silences that shit on a personal cellular phone level. It's treason.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#234

Post by haunter »

bottlepalm wrote: post #11

Is there anyone else who doesn't support either side of this conflict? They've been fighting each other for over 100 years. They both want the same piece of land. It's on them to figure it out. People around the world don't need to 'pick a side'. We can protest for both sides to sort their shit out, and not drag the rest of us into it.

Honestly I couldn't care less.

If anything I'd want to see less current politics on HN

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#235

Post by SauciestGNU »

flumpcakes wrote: post #218
trandango wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There absolutely are restrictions. No journalists are allowed in Gaza, which is at odds with almost every other conflict in the past hundred years. The stated reason is "to keep journalists safe". But journalists have risked their lives in many conflicts to bring the news to people, its their choice to risk their life or not. Unless one were to believe that all journalists biased against israel, there is no reason to…

Is this true? I do not think journalists are just allowed to the front lines of any war. The entire Gaza strip seems like one giant front line. There needs to be more journalists reporting but I think just allowing anyone to walk anywhere because they've got 'press' on their jacket is probably just going to end up with dead journalists considering journalists will want to be were the fighting is and will gravitate to…

IDF also kills journalists for sport (Shireen Abu-Akleh comes to mind).

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#236

Post by dang »

_wire_ wrote: post #147
dang wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having spent entire days moderating previous threads on this topic, I know what kind of conversation we're likely to get. But abandoning discussion altogether is also not an option. > I don't understand why you even want this topic on HackerNews. I don't think I'd say 'want' (what I want is to spend Sunday afternoons working on something else), but the issue is the principles by which we moderate the site. If you loo…

This point inadvertently exposes an aspect of information management which is sorely unaddressed and inadequate to purposes of understanding within a commonwealth: That situations conflict which are already well understood to history are regurgitated as mysteries, and the knowledge system is practically useless to providing coherent access to previous experience and context. When a mod has to write: > If you look at…

> Why has a new thread been created?

A user posted it and other users upvoted it. Other users flagged it, but I chose to turn off the flags on this one, for reasons I've explained at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40267862 and in many other places linked to there.

> Why isn't this article and the attending thread of comments already situated within existing paths of discourse

It is in the sense that the web already does that. I often post lists of related links from past HN discussion (https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...), but that's not doable when my hair is on fire and I'm also trying to keep my head above water.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#237

Post by afavour »

dotancohen wrote: post #140
loceng wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Then let me go on record as saying that I fully support my government and my army's efforts to return the remaining hostages even in the face of double-standard world efforts to legitimize the genocidal, racist, homophobic, and misogynistic Hamas regime.

> in the face of double-standard world efforts to legitimize the genocidal, racist, homophobic, and misogynistic Hamas regime.

I ask this question very genuinely: what world efforts are seeking to legitimize Hamas? I have seen a great many pro-Palestinian perspectives but have not seen anything pro-Hamas beyond fringe kooks.

As for double standard… I think the reason you see the double standard is precisely because the comparison is racist, homophonic, misogynistic, etc. Israel is held to a higher standard than neighbouring countries because it’s a liberal democracy as opposed to a theocratic dictatorship. I (as an outsider of course) would think it a great loss for the world if Israel starts to consider Iran to be the bar they have to clear rather than anything higher.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#238

Post by bawolff »

C6JEsQeQa5fCjE wrote: post #203
dotancohen wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then let me go on record as saying that I fully support my government and my army's efforts to return the remaining hostages even in the face of double-standard world efforts to legitimize the genocidal, racist, homophobic, and misogynistic Hamas regime.

> Then let me go on record as saying that I fully support my government and my army's efforts to return the remaining hostages [...] This is a common talking point that makes no sense when you think about it. Could you please explain how you envision the hostage release to be achieved through bombing and systematic destruction of the area that they are held in? It sounds much more likely to kill them instead. Why not…

> Could you please explain how you envision the hostage release to be achieved through bombing and systematic destruction of the area that they are held in? It sounds much more likely to kill them instead. Why not simply negotiate a hostage exchange?

That presumes that there is something hamas wants that is viable for israel to give them. Its far from obvious that is the case in this conflict.

Its not like "carrot and stick" negotiating tactics are unique to this conflict.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#239

Post by seydor »

dang wrote: post #12
x3n0ph3n3 wrote: post #9

@dang -- you're not going to get the polite, respectful conversation on this topic that I think you're hoping for. Instead, you're going to get criticisms on the legitimacy of each organization involved in this conflict. I don't understand why you even want this topic on HackerNews.

Having spent entire days moderating previous threads on this topic, I know what kind of conversation we're likely to get. But abandoning discussion altogether is also not an option. > I don't understand why you even want this topic on HackerNews. I don't think I'd say 'want' (what I want is to spend Sunday afternoons working on something else), but the issue is the principles by which we moderate the site. If you loo…

> But abandoning discussion altogether is also not an option.

This is the most interesting position i ve seen on the subject.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#240

Post by erichocean »

exe34 wrote: post #195
cjk2 wrote: post #176

Just a point about Al Jazeera that is worth mentioning. There are two Al Jazeeras. One which is presented to Western audiences and one which is presented to Middle-Eastern audiences. The media and articles are politically aligned in each region. Don't assume what you read in the US/UK/wherever is the same as over there. In the case of Israel, the Middle-Eastern unit were literally showing videos demanding further upr…

I didn't realise they had two versions, but it makes sense. Is the anti-infidel version only available in Arabic then?

CNN has two versions too, one for US audiences and one for the world.
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