Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 1001 posts

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#131

Post by kergonath »

dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #46

If I was Jewish I'd be very upset of what is being done in my name. The Israeli government, by insisting any criticism is antisemitic, is equating Judaism with its own actions. With their existing extreme, brazen and opportunistic behavior they're slowly mainstreaming antisemitism as outrage grows at the government and people accept being called 'antisemitic' if they oppose it. It's a tragedy for Jews. I don't say th…

It’s a standard behaviour in theocracies. Being against the Al-Sauds means being against Islam (according to the Saudi government), other governments do that too. Being against Trump is being against Christianism (according to Republican fundamentalists, hopefully those won’t end up in the cabinet again).

The State props up the religion by normalising it and undermining its competition, and the religion props up the state by providing convenient pretexts and effective brainwashing mechanisms. I am not Jewish, but I find it particularly disgusting too. My sympathies to humanist Jews who are thrown into this nightmare.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#132

Post by yonixw »

orwin wrote: post #97
yonixwm wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other extreme, Are media that spread misinformation without any due process are just protected indefinitely? Like in this very recent case: https://honestreporting.com/damage-done-how-al-jazeeras-fake... Edit: haaretz link: https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/palestinians/2024-0...

I've read the article. One counterpoint though: The reason stated on why Hamas affirmed the rape story was false wasn't 'because it backfired and made civilians flee'. This never happened,and the justifications is too convoluted. No, they took a page out of IRA and ETA's: total transparency. They want people to believe what they say, and for that, you can't be caught lying. I don't know if it's recent or not, but tha…

> If a news is from a Hamas official spokesman, it's likely true

What? They lie constantly! They just got caught. Here is what happened when BBC just reported them without checking:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67140250

And then when they apologized admitting they should have not speculate:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/19/israel-accuses...

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#133

Post by JumpCrisscross »

bob1029 wrote: post #39
dang wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having spent entire days moderating previous threads on this topic, I know what kind of conversation we're likely to get. But abandoning discussion altogether is also not an option. > I don't understand why you even want this topic on HackerNews. I don't think I'd say 'want' (what I want is to spend Sunday afternoons working on something else), but the issue is the principles by which we moderate the site. If you loo…

> But abandoning discussion altogether is also not an option. I don't see why not. Just because it's hard doesn't mean it shouldn't be an option. This attitude toward moderation is a large reason I do not participate on this site like I used to.

> because it's hard doesn't mean it shouldn't be an option

I hope it's not. Trolls aside, I've found HN's discussion on this topic to be interesting.

For example, this comment [1]. I hadn't considered belligerent status as a relevant factor before. (It's obvious once pointed out, and not a decisive factor. But it has weight nevertheless.)

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40268043

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#134

Post by JumpCrisscross »

avip wrote: post #118
NewJazz wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is Qatar a belligerent in the war? Belarus has allowed Russia to use their territory as a point from which to launch both ground assaults and missiles into Ukraine. Hard to say the same about Qatar and Hamas. If Al Jazeera were an Iranian publication the comparison might be more similar. Israeli news reports and analysts say Qatar has sent more than $1 billion to Gaza over the past decade. Qatar sent that aid through…

Is this some kind of rhetorical question? Qatar is the main funder of Hamas regime. And hosting Hamas leadership. They fund Hamas more than Iran, according to Israeli intelligence (which may be wrong but that’s the source we have)

> Qatar is the main funder of Hamas regime

Iran is Hamas' main backer. Qatar funded Hamas with Israel's consent, so it's not really fair to hold this against Doha. (Their continuing to host Hamas' leadership is fair to criticise.)

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#135

Post by noduerme »

deciplex wrote: post #93
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only justification would be if they are broadcasting government secrets. Clearly they're not doing that, just criticizing the government. The obvious next step is outlawing any speech criticizing the government (or rather 'speech that is a threat to national security'), then you've got the same laws as in Russia.

Israel is also responsible for 3/4 of all journalist deaths in the last year.

[flagged]

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#136

Post by wudangmonk »

LocalH wrote: post #27
stoperaticless wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tic toc was recently banned in US.

Tik Tok isn't a news agency

Its not but it is being banned because people are getting their news from there and its not following the right narrative that the 'real' news agencies are failing at peddling to the public.

Then again I could be wrong and the U.S government just doesn't like people people dancing, hard to tell which one is the reason behind it all.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#137

Post by kromem »

yonixwm wrote: post #21
phantompeace wrote: post #14

Any regime that seeks to suppress the media can't be up to any good, IMO.

On the other extreme, Are media that spread misinformation without any due process are just protected indefinitely? Like in this very recent case: https://honestreporting.com/damage-done-how-al-jazeeras-fake... Edit: haaretz link: https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/palestinians/2024-0...

Are you saying that every news outlet that reports false claims by eyewitness accounts which turn out not to be true and aren't sufficiently loud about retractions should be banned by their host countries?

Because I can think of quite a number of stories over the years, and even in terms of this current conflict in the Middle East, where there were falsehoods in the fog of war or even intentionally seeded that turned out not to be true and many of the news organizations airing them initially only took stories down and didn't run front page denouncements of their own reporting.

I agree that retractions and in general journalistic integrity needs a bit more attention as a global society, but banning news organizations that print things you don't like is something I tend to associate with a very Stalinesque mindset and not a bastion of democracy and liberty.

In general, individuals and groups are bettered by exposure to naysayers than surrounded by yes-men.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#138

Post by beyondCritics »

TheGuyWhoCodes wrote: post #87
brabel wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's disinformation according to the Government though, which is the same thing happening here with Israel, isn't it? Do you believe Al Jazeera is spreading misinformation? Even if Israel says so? Even if the USA starts saying so as well? I don't know where we can draw a line here.

We can draw the line when they report proven false information and never apologize for reporting so. We can draw the line when they say one thing on English Al Jazeera and another on Arabic Al Jazeera. We can draw the line when their reporters were (since then eliminated) active member of Hamas rocket teams.

Can you back up the implied claims with some references?

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#139

Post by JumpCrisscross »

andsoitis wrote: post #77
_Microft wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's neither surprising nor necessarily bad. Just think of how Russia Today was spreading disinformation and propaganda about the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Banning them from the EU was certainly in our interest.

> Banning them from the EU was certainly in our interest. but you had no say in the matter; so if a future ban is not in your interest, what will you do? no, the government should not stifle the market of ideas. that is not in our interest in the long run.

> the government should not stifle the market of ideas

America is uniquely individualistic, our First Amendment uniquely strong. I believe in it. But it's not clear it's the only optimum.

Re: Israel shuts down local Al Jazeera offices

#140

Post by dotancohen »

loceng wrote: post #43
afavour wrote: post #15

I’m not sure about “dark day for the media” but it does feel like a dark day for Israel. Once you’ve established that the government can unilaterally ban a voice for reasons of “national security” you’ve essentially given them a free pass. As Americans living post-9/11 will know, “national security” is a deliberately elastic term that can cover anything required in the moment.

[flagged]

Then let me go on record as saying that I fully support my government and my army's efforts to return the remaining hostages even in the face of double-standard world efforts to legitimize the genocidal, racist, homophobic, and misogynistic Hamas regime.
Post reply on HN