251–260 of 405 posts
Rule number one of being a rebel. Don’t do it at work. Protest all you want in the public streets where you have freedom of assembly. You do NOT have that freedom within a corporate office building. Regardless of employer. A few firings and maybe they’ll get the message to take it outside. I empathize with people wanting to speak out over something they are passionate about. I do this often. Just know your venue and…
Don't work for the Empire.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> Rule number one of being a rebel. Don’t do it at work By doing it at work, they are risking high paying jobs, putting their careers at risk. In public. Risking something for a protest is the whole point. To the extent that they do that with their eyes open, risking high paying jobs, they are heroes. If they do that thinking the people who control Google will be fine with that and they will still keep their jobs, t…
Then they shouldn't be suing imo. Suing implies they think they shouldn't have been fired, which means their risk was not intentional. So they're not heroes.
The protestors want change from the company. So they protest. The company wants to shut them up. So they fire everyone.
The protestors still want change, now plus compensation. So they sue. Not suing makes no sense, as it concedes defeat and gets them no closer to their goals.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who says that a totalitarian attitude is desirable?? Freedom of speech implies that expressing your opinions should not cost you your job.
The issue with free speech historically or currently worldwide is that governments can silence, jail or kill you. It’s a civic issue, not business one.
> “There’s been a total change in the way Google responds to employees trying to have a voice in their workplace,” the fired software engineer said. “It’s night and day from the Google of even five, 10 years ago.” Having a political voice is different than having a voice against sexual harassment at the workplace. Please don't mix things that don't belong together. Radically expressing your political voice during you…
Who says that a totalitarian attitude is desirable?? Freedom of speech implies that expressing your opinions should not cost you your job.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
No it does not and it never has. Freedom of speech is a protection from the government, not other citizens. And I suspect the only reason people take this view is because the speech is something they agree with. Would you, for example, feel like Google was being totalitarian if Hitler Hank hosted a sit in protest against the company for hiring people of color and he was subsequently fired?
Yes, it does. The right to free speech is not a right if exercising it costs you your livelihood. The idea that freedom of speech only restricts the government's actions is typical American myopia. George Washington didn't copyright freedom of expression and the US constitution is not the end all to human rights.
This sort of free speech has never existed and frankly it would be preposterous for it to exist.
A company couldn't fire a salesperson that went around telling potential customers "Hey, our product is garbage you should use our competitors"? A state employee couldn't be fired for lying to the races they don't like "You don't qualify for this, sorry". An employee couldn't be fired for sexually harassing coworkers because "Welp, free speech, can't stop Bill from telling Jill how much he wants to have sex with her".
If we take this right to its natural conclusion, it would preclude other rights like the freedom of association.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're aware that the person you're responding to could be a direct/first-generation survivor?
I'm am, but following Nature's rules that's becoming very unlikely even if we see more and more of these "survivors" on the Internet lately.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
At almost every company I've worked over the years, I had to go through countless mandatory annual trainings that effectively says expressing opinions on non work related subjective political topics with coworkers/employer is not advisable, risky and can be grounds for termination in extreme cases. Either these people genuinely believed there was scope for discussion, or believed their opinion/choice of topic is a PR…
What country and what company made you undergo these "countless" training sessions? I suspect you are making stuff up.
But hey, if you are an IT employee and haven't had to go through those annoying trainings I'd be surprised and a little jealous.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who says that a totalitarian attitude is desirable?? Freedom of speech implies that expressing your opinions should not cost you your job.
Has the illiberal left not been smugly telling us " Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences " when others lost their jobs? They hardly have any right to complain when they are hoist by their own petard.
That doesn't explain why the right - which has been just as smugly insisting that freedom of speech must mean freedom from consequences - doesn't seem to have a problem with it.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Has the illiberal left not been smugly telling us " Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences " when others lost their jobs? They hardly have any right to complain when they are hoist by their own petard.
OK cool. That doesn't explain why the right - which has been just as smugly insisting that freedom of speech must mean freedom from consequences - doesn't seem to have a problem with it.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
OK cool. That doesn't explain why the right - which has been just as smugly insisting that freedom of speech must mean freedom from consequences - doesn't seem to have a problem with it.
I couldn't care less what the conservatives think. Their blatantly fake support of freedom of speech was always conditional and self-serving.