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Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

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Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#61

Post by rufus_foreman »

zeroonetwothree wrote: post #55
rufus_foreman wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Rule number one of being a rebel. Don’t do it at work By doing it at work, they are risking high paying jobs, putting their careers at risk. In public. Risking something for a protest is the whole point. To the extent that they do that with their eyes open, risking high paying jobs, they are heroes. If they do that thinking the people who control Google will be fine with that and they will still keep their jobs, t…

Their actions achieved nothing of consequence. I don't see how that makes them "heroes", even from the point of view of someone that supports their views.

>> Their actions achieved nothing of consequence

They drew attention to their cause, you're talking about them. You're talking about their cause.

>> even from the point of view of someone that supports their views

What views of theirs do you support, exactly?

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#62

Post by khazhoux »

zeroonetwothree wrote: post #50
xyst wrote: post #12

Has anybody noticed that whenever the protests pop up. Major news outlets tend to spin them as some sort of haven for “anti-Semitism” or cite them as the “violent protests”. I have yet to see organizations (at least on the ground, in major press releases) cite anything that represents hate against the Jewish population. Only rhetoric I have heard is those protesting the horrific actions of the Israeli government/mili…

Obviously not all protesters are anti-semitic but you must be willfully ignorant to honestly believe that none of them are. For example, here are some signs that have been found in protests (you can find examples on google): - "from the river to the sea" -> implies the destruction of Israel - "keep the world clean" -> seems to imply some sort of "cleansing" of Jews - "by any means necessary" -> seems to condone viole…

Is someone actually claiming that none of them are anti-semitic?

The pro-Hamas antisemites are in the tiny majority of the protesters.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#63

Post by defrost »

nsguy wrote: post #48
slantedview wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These protests aren't about Hamas though. There are other protests about that, and surely those are valid. These protests are about Israel's campaign of what UN officials say is genocide. Most attempts to change the subject to Hamas are bad faith attempts to protect Israel from culpability.

UN officials don't say it's genocide and anyways they're not the arbiters of that claim. Changing the subject to Hamas is not bad faith. Hamas is the ruler of Gaza, was voted into power, and enjoys support of most Palestinians. It's impossible for Israel to "separate" its war on Hamas from the population within it resides. The ignoring of Hamas by the anti-Israel crowd is what's bad faith. Do you separate the Russian…

> Hamas is the ruler of Gaza, was voted into power, and enjoys support of most Palestinians.

Hamas was voted in 18 years ago with less than 45% of the vote on a platform of clean government and keeping peace with Israel based on the 1967 borders.

Hamas today is not the Hamas that was voted in, very few Palestinians alive today voted for them.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#64

Post by khazhoux »

hedora wrote: post #53
xyst wrote: post #12

Has anybody noticed that whenever the protests pop up. Major news outlets tend to spin them as some sort of haven for “anti-Semitism” or cite them as the “violent protests”. I have yet to see organizations (at least on the ground, in major press releases) cite anything that represents hate against the Jewish population. Only rhetoric I have heard is those protesting the horrific actions of the Israeli government/mili…

A lot of people are spreading a false equivalence between being antisemitic and protesting the slaughter of civilians and children. Does that count?

This is very true.

Still, I’m terribly disappointed how reticent that side is to strongly condemn Hamas and 10/7.

Their message is not clean.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#65

Post by D13Fd »

llm_nerd wrote: post #34
manlobster wrote: post #16

Googler protests in the past have typically been walk-outs and other outdoor gatherings. This protest took place within the offices. Some of the protestors occupied senior executives' offices for many hours, and had to be removed by the police. Some of the protestors also streamed their protest from within the offices of the notoriously confidentiality-obsessed company. I don't buy the narrative that Google is cracki…

I think it's fair to say that Google is cracking down. They did tolerate activities like this previously, but came down like a hammer on this. It seems like they are setting a precedent and giving fair warning to anyone else thinking of doing something similar. Things like this can be viral, as seen with the college protests. And the more enabled they are, the worse they get, as seen with Columbia. And to be fair the…

> I find it rather incredible. They end it by announcing that they should all be reinstated because they "did nothing wrong". They repeatedly talk as if they expected just to have their "concerns heard", to get a warning, etc.

Yeah. This is true "privilege" speaking -- they don't seem to realize how fortunate they were to be in their positions in the first place.

Companies employ you because it's a good deal for them. If you're lucky, you find a place where it is a good deal for you too. Protesting and disrupting work changes that calculus for the company. It's no longer a good deal for them, and the unsurprising result is that they don't want to employ such people or hire them back.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#66

Post by Georgelemental »

zeroCalories wrote: post #57
Georgelemental wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> where the most prominent voices in the movement support Hamas I suppose that depends on your definition of "the movement". But I am close friends with one of the activist leaders for divesting from Israeli government-linked companies on my university campus—and they're Jewish. So I'm personally skeptical of the scaremongering propaganda

Are you suggesting that there aren't Jews that support Hamas? I've known plenty of Uncle Toms and Kapos in my life.

> there aren't Jews that support Hamas

There are around 16 million Jews in the world, I'm sure you can find one or two to support more or less anything. But the Uncle Tom/Kapo analogy doesn't work; there are no Jews under Hamas rule (other than the hostages ofc) so there is no incentive for any of them to betray their people in that way.

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#67

Post by xyst »

nsguy wrote: post #42
xyst wrote: post #12

Has anybody noticed that whenever the protests pop up. Major news outlets tend to spin them as some sort of haven for “anti-Semitism” or cite them as the “violent protests”. I have yet to see organizations (at least on the ground, in major press releases) cite anything that represents hate against the Jewish population. Only rhetoric I have heard is those protesting the horrific actions of the Israeli government/mili…

Just one example: "Eby’s remarks on the encampment came after he and other politicians denounced an earlier demonstration in Vancouver where protesters chanted “long live Oct. 7,” praising that day’s attacks by Hamas on Israel." https://www.cheknews.ca/eby-deplores-most-hateful-speech-pra... https://nationalpost.com/opinion/group-banned-in-germany-get... I think Israel's PR machine is very ineffective. It's swamped b…

In the Vancouver demonstration referenced by “Eby”, I see the chants were from a group called “ Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP).”

Appears to be a known terrorist organization. Is this organization affiliated with ALL or most of the college campus organizers we see across the USA?

Something I’ll have to ask and bring up. Something smells odd.

In the second article, it references a group or network called “ Samidoun Prisoners Solidarity Network” which again appears to have links to PFLP. Maybe the fundraising and propaganda machine arm.

All sources indicate both orgs with ties to past violence but does that mean that these 2 orgs are tied to every college campus student org as well?

Nothing is quite clear here. Not enough information. Need some real journalists to clear the air.

I agree. These orgs and people are disgusting. But the gatherings and protests I have been to have not chanted anything of this sort. Not even a dog whistle as mentioned in some comments.

I’ll have to do more digging though. Thanks for providing some links though

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#68

Post by acdha »

defrost wrote: post #63
nsguy wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UN officials don't say it's genocide and anyways they're not the arbiters of that claim. Changing the subject to Hamas is not bad faith. Hamas is the ruler of Gaza, was voted into power, and enjoys support of most Palestinians. It's impossible for Israel to "separate" its war on Hamas from the population within it resides. The ignoring of Hamas by the anti-Israel crowd is what's bad faith. Do you separate the Russian…

> Hamas is the ruler of Gaza, was voted into power, and enjoys support of most Palestinians. Hamas was voted in 18 years ago with less than 45% of the vote on a platform of clean government and keeping peace with Israel based on the 1967 borders. Hamas today is not the Hamas that was voted in, very few Palestinians alive today voted for them.

Re: your last point, the median age is around 18 so half the population wasn’t even born the last time there was an election. I cannot imagine what it must be like growing up with so little control over your life.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_State_of_P...

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#69

Post by someotherperson »

zeroonetwothree wrote: post #50
xyst wrote: post #12

Has anybody noticed that whenever the protests pop up. Major news outlets tend to spin them as some sort of haven for “anti-Semitism” or cite them as the “violent protests”. I have yet to see organizations (at least on the ground, in major press releases) cite anything that represents hate against the Jewish population. Only rhetoric I have heard is those protesting the horrific actions of the Israeli government/mili…

Obviously not all protesters are anti-semitic but you must be willfully ignorant to honestly believe that none of them are. For example, here are some signs that have been found in protests (you can find examples on google): - "from the river to the sea" -> implies the destruction of Israel - "keep the world clean" -> seems to imply some sort of "cleansing" of Jews - "by any means necessary" -> seems to condone viole…

You can read this into anything.

> - "from the river to the sea" -> implies the destruction of Israel

The Israeli vs. Palestinian conflict is, for the Palestinians, about property rights. And both sides claim the full area between the Jordan river to the Sea. Plenty of groups say the same thing, whether it's the Chinese view on Taiwan ("one China!") or the ISIS view on the Middle East (and half of Europe and Asia..) being "one Ummah" and nobody calls it racist.

The funny part with that is that it's literally just a pun on the original Israeli Likud party slogan of "between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty"[0]. The other day Netanyahu said the same thing with "West of the Jordan river."[1] Is that whatever the Palestinian equivalent of antisemitism is?

> - "keep the world clean" -> seems to imply some sort of "cleansing" of Jews

All the examples I've seen (as stupid as the phrase is, people seem to copy it as if it's witty) have included the Israeli flag. There are plenty of people that roast Turks and Turkey, but the addition of the crescent moon on their flag doesn't turn into a roast on all of Islam.

Israel has intentionally conflated being anti-Jewish with being anti-Israeli so that you can't target the latter, but somehow also rides the wave of Israeli actions can't be attributed to Jews in general. It's a strange take but if anything has led to a rise in actual antisemitism (as in the anti-Jewish variety) it has been that intentional muddying of the waters.

This also isn't to take away from your main point that there is plenty of real antisemitism out there. I'm sure there is, and it's probably underreported if anything. But the majority of the examples given by pro-Israeli groups (chosen only because they're most visible) are not it.

[0] https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/original-party-platform...

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgdFOIiRpr0

Re: Google workers fired for protesting Israeli contract file NLRB complaint

#70

Post by xyst »

AxEy wrote: post #47
xyst wrote: post #12

Has anybody noticed that whenever the protests pop up. Major news outlets tend to spin them as some sort of haven for “anti-Semitism” or cite them as the “violent protests”. I have yet to see organizations (at least on the ground, in major press releases) cite anything that represents hate against the Jewish population. Only rhetoric I have heard is those protesting the horrific actions of the Israeli government/mili…

Does this qualify? https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/ucb-police-seek-... "The five people were part of a group of about 200 protesters, who on Feb. 26 broke down the door of Zellerbach Playhouse and smashed a window to prevent Israeli lawyer Ran Bar-Yoshafat from addressing a group of Jewish students. Danielle Sobkin, co-president of Bears for Israel, one of the campus groups who invited Bar-Yoshafat, said…

5 people acting in mob mentality doesn’t exactly fit the bill of a whole organization sponsoring the hate crime. Seems more like smooth brain assholes that want to fuck it up for everyone. Which honestly every protest has at least a few.

Are there are any orgs in UC Berkeley supporting these hateful actions? Are any of the 5 people leaders of the student orgs? Or local orgs in the area? So many unanswered questions. Too much speculation.

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