Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe • Hacker News Board

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#391

Post by robben1234 » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:12 AM UTC

chmod775 wrote: post #353

captn3m0 wrote: post #52

> In both cases, she used sophisticated tradecraft that sought to leave no trace in databases accessible to European authorities. For instance, she booked her trips and bought her plane tickets using her Czech passport, registering only that nationality with the Greek airline. But upon crossing the Russian border, Šapošnikova used her secret Russian passport, thus bypassing the need to obtain a Russian visa issued to…

>Wouldn't the Greek airline (and Greek exit immigration control) check for a valid Russian visa for a Czech passport? There's no exit stamp for EU citizens leaving the EU. Also nobody cares whether you actually have a valid visa for the place you're going. It's not their responsibility. Maybe somewhere in some paperwork they make you say that you do and nominally they're supposed to check it, but I'm not sure anyone…

Airlines always check additional documentation for people with passports that do not get visa-free entry to destination. It's a liability issue - they would have to fly that person back if they are not let in.

Of course airlines do not care about documents allowing you entry to the departure point.

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#392

Post by Swannie » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:14 AM UTC

hughdbrown wrote: post #266

garyrob wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want to give some advice: Don't judge it by its first few episodes. When I first checked it out, the basic setup seemed rather inane and I stopped watching. Then, a couple years later, I needed something to watch during long exercise sessions and I checked it out again. It was getting much more interesting by the end of the first season. And every season got better and richer. By the very end, I experienced it as a…

Try this: look up the most highly rated episodes on IMDB and watch only those. Missing the crummy episodes usually does not interfere with understanding the story arc. Often, I set a minimum IMDB score that I will watch, like 8.5 or 9.0 to capture only the best. This works well with series that: - take a year or two to find their footing or - have a large cast (some mediocre) that get their own story lines of no cons…

I have a feeling this would work well with MadMen.

There were always a few "filler" episodes that didn't move the story forward much, if at all.

But sometimes those filler's are just good tropey fun! :-)

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#393

Post by stoperaticless » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:21 AM UTC

The_Colonel wrote: post #164

surfingdino wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU, Germany in particular, was not interested in making a big deal out of it for fear of getting cut off from the Russian teat. German economy was set up to run on Russian gas and oil and Germany has a lot of influence over Czechia so there was likely some pressure to keep things quiet. But in 2021 there was enough evidence on who did it and what was being planned to take action.

> But in 2021 there was enough evidence on who did it and what was being planned to take action. Seems like you agree the reason it was not published before 2021 was that there wasn't enough evidence collected yet. Isn't that the most parsimonious explanation? Why do you feel the need to add this superfluous German angle / Russian resources unfounded speculation?

Vanishingly small amount of facts that affect us are proven in court or by scientific experiment.

When living on this world, one must do a lot of “speculation”, to derive most probable explanations based on limited information available. I guess one could call it “personal opinion”, “informed opinion”, or even “expert oponion” depending on the context.

In this specific case, worth remembering, that speed of investigations depend on resources allocated to it; resource allocation is easily impacted by politics.

Here is an unrelated example, but it illustrates an attempt to appease Russia: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-14202371 (there was European Arrest Warrant for ex-kgb guy over old eastern Europe stuff; in 2011 Austria detained him, but then swiftly released him within 24 hours)

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#394

Post by ivan_gammel » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:27 AM UTC

refurb wrote: post #323

epolanski wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is very sloppy of Russia. Why even bother doing something so dumb? Because the scheme predates today's digital capabilities.

That doesn't make much sense. If you have suspected spies, the first you'd do is pull their entry into the country. It wouldn't take long to realize the similarity between passport numbers. Even in the 1950's.

You cannot draw any conclusions from this similarity alone. The scheme is common and sequential numbers were likely used in many other legitimate cases. You think this is a flop only because The Insider has found very close numbers of passports for people in the same military unit. But there are just 4 numbers of 100 in the same range. Is there any evidence that the remaining people belong to the same unit, are spies or even work for Russian government?

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#395

Post by stoperaticless » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:33 AM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #86

timthelion wrote: post #40

What I don't understand is why the attack on the Czech Republic was not seen as an attack by Russia on NATO.

That's a very good question. The problem is what's next if they acknowledge that. Say it is acknowledged as an attack on a NATO member, but nothing is done. That immediately turns NATO's worth from whatever its is worth now, to less than the paper it was printed on in 1999 when the Check Republic joined the organization. That's the achilles heel of NATO, and the Russian government knows it. Same goes for Baltic count…

One way to alleviate patch up that achiles heel is a bit shady: proportional indirect responses. (E.g. Wagner forces in north Africa are not officially part of Russian army…)

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#396

Post by riehwvfbk » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:34 AM UTC

robben1234 wrote: post #390

captn3m0 wrote: post #52

> In both cases, she used sophisticated tradecraft that sought to leave no trace in databases accessible to European authorities. For instance, she booked her trips and bought her plane tickets using her Czech passport, registering only that nationality with the Greek airline. But upon crossing the Russian border, Šapošnikova used her secret Russian passport, thus bypassing the need to obtain a Russian visa issued to…

I don't follow how is this concerning. All people with more than one citizenship I know at least via a few handshakes use their passports exactly this way for travel. Why would a Russian citizen go through the hoops of getting a Russian visa on their Czech passport? Does Czechia not allow dual citizenship to call the second secret?

In fact, they would not be eligible for this visa in the first place. Same thing for the US: "U.S. citizens are not eligible for a U.S. visa. " https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/international-tra...

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#397

Post by ajuc » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:35 AM UTC

dzhiurgis wrote: post #322

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #9

This is my semi annual plug for all of you to watch the fantastic and somehow forgotten FX network TV show, The Americans, A spy drama set in Washington DC in the 1980s about KGB “illegals” posing as travel agents. It’s way better than any basic cable TV show had any right to be. Plus, all seasons are streaming on Hulu, so you don’t have to worry about whether the story will be completed. https://www.hulu.com/series/…

Heh it's all too real for us in Eastern Europe. Back in Soviet Union if you ever get a blessing to visit another country, you have interviews with KGB, one before leaving and one on return. Upon return they asked if you bringing any contraband, currency and one of the question is "Why did you return?". So, my parents lived with me in NZ for last few months. When they got back dad's boating mates decided to grill him…

It was fun all around.

To be allowed to leave you had to sign a paper promising to "tell" the secret service on your travel companions after the trip. So everybody on the trip was living in paranoia of one another.

It was mostly to later have some blackmail material on you if you became opposition - you signed the paper so you're an agent of the system.

And when (if) you returned - regular people assumed you have some connections to the regime and treated you like an enemy.

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#398

Post by cenamus » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:47 AM UTC

gmerc wrote: post #362

Christo, Michael and Bellingcat have done more to make Europe safe than most intelligence services on the continent. In fact many of those have shown to be compromised by the Russians from the right extremism side - Maassen in Germany, The Wirecard dude in Austria, etc.

If it was only the Maršalek guy im Austria, we literally had an intelligence agent on Russian payroll, police walking out of the Russian embassy with cash gifts...

And of course a certain party that is all too fond of the Russian corruption money, literally saying the want Austria to turn into a second Orban regime.

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#399

Post by RoyalHenOil » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 5:57 AM UTC

robben1234 wrote: post #390

captn3m0 wrote: post #52

> In both cases, she used sophisticated tradecraft that sought to leave no trace in databases accessible to European authorities. For instance, she booked her trips and bought her plane tickets using her Czech passport, registering only that nationality with the Greek airline. But upon crossing the Russian border, Šapošnikova used her secret Russian passport, thus bypassing the need to obtain a Russian visa issued to…

I don't follow how is this concerning. All people with more than one citizenship I know at least via a few handshakes use their passports exactly this way for travel. Why would a Russian citizen go through the hoops of getting a Russian visa on their Czech passport? Does Czechia not allow dual citizenship to call the second secret?

We don't necessarily even have a choice. I have two passports, and I have to use both of them when I travel between my two countries of citizenship, which is the only overseas travel I do.

If just one of them goes missing, then I am stranded — no matter which country I'm in or which passport I lost — until I can get it renewed. It is illegal for me to just get a visa on my other passport and travel on that instead.

Re: Husband and wife outed as GRU spies aiding bombings and poisonings across Europe

#400

Post by anovikov » Tue, Apr 30, 2024, 6:04 AM UTC

jojobas wrote: post #364

gmerc wrote: post #362

Christo, Michael and Bellingcat have done more to make Europe safe than most intelligence services on the continent. In fact many of those have shown to be compromised by the Russians from the right extremism side - Maassen in Germany, The Wirecard dude in Austria, etc.

It's not much safer now that a bunch of disposable Russians have been exposed. Russian businessmen moved to the EU and the US by the thousand per year. We won't know who of them are "businessmen" and nobody is even pretending to check.

Well it's a lot better than not letting them leave. Staying in and paying taxes there supports Putin; plus if they knew they are stuck in and can't move to the civilised world, they'd have to develop some sense of belonging with Russia. EU is making everything possible to suck out everyone with half the brain from Russia and this is a good thing. A lot of new immigration programs that appear to be specifically tailored to be convenient for Russians, appeared since the war began. So the logic is to:

- make tourism/travel harder by limiting visas and having people fly through far away stopovers (Dubai, Istanbul, or Belgrade for those who can afford $2K economy ticket)

- make immigration easier

- make any cross-border business harder - no SWIFT, no way to get in Russian IT-related money and most of the money overall even if transfer happens through 3rd world, etc.

This way people leave, realise they can't live in 2 countries and have to pick, then realise they can't do cross border business nearly as conveniently as they hoped, so concentrate on local or US market, then realise how much easier it is vs doing business in Russia (all they need to do that is a magic kick to initially force them to), and never look back.

Granted, few of them believe in democracy or even opposed to Putin. Mostly they see Europe as "safe place with a system which is easy to game", but that's OK. Their children will integrate and will be different. After all, save for American expats and Hong Kong refugees (who go to UK anyway), these are by far the best kind of immigrants Europe can hope for.