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Google lays off its Python team

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Re: Google lays off its Python team

#321

Post by bdd8f1df777b »

CydeWeys wrote: post #258
zem wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i reckon we simply got offshored, since they're now building a whole new python team in munich, though i don't know whether for cost reasons or to expand the languages presence in the munich office or both.

Why would they lay off the existing team first, rather than spin up the new team, have the old team train the new team, and give old team members a chance to move countries if they wanted?

I can only speculate: some directors/vps got headcount reduction goals (reduce eng cost by XXX with deadline at XXX), and they couldn't meet those goals if the layoff is to be delayed until the new team is fully operational.

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#322

Post by bdd8f1df777b »

CydeWeys wrote: post #265
throwaway5959 wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were maintaining Python itself, likely very well (as one would expect) compensated. It’d be a waste to have these devs do product development.

All SWEs at the same level at Google are making the same compensation (with some exceptions for high-flying AI researchers). They Python SWEs certainly weren't making more than anyone else.

That's not true at all. (Excluding the factor of location), the compensation of a SWE depends not only the level, but also on tenure, on performance rating (and the history of rating), and on stock market fluctuations (whether the stock price was low or high when the stocks were granted).

One of the rumors is that the better compensated you are on your level, the more likely you are to be targeted for layoff, because it saves the eng cost the most.

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#323

Post by smsm42 »

jubalfh wrote: post #293
smsm42 wrote: post #117

I love if though when people working for trillion dollar corporation getting high six figure salaries and probably more money in a year than average worker in most countries makes in a lifetime, casually dunk on "capitalism". Yeah, sure, in the USSR you'd do much better, dude. I mean, I know layoffs suck, but come on.

you do realise that ussr does not exist anymore (it's been replaced with a hyper-capitalist structure that mutated into a fascist dictatorship); and that the existence of people being highly paid does not disprove the fact tha the us-style capitalism is a terrible system for anyone but the highest echelons?

> you do realise that ussr does not exist anymore

O RLY?! That fact totally changes my whole argument... unless it was an example of a non-capitalist society and I never claimed it currently exists and the point was the comparison of living in capitalist and non-capitalist system.

> the existence of people being highly paid does not disprove the fact tha the us-style capitalism is a terrible system for anyone but the highest echelons

The guy complaining about it is the highest echelons. He was working for frickign Google, which pays tons of money. Not that this duckspeak isn't a complete lie for pretty much all people. As a person who, unlike you, actually lived in the USSR, I can tell you that it had humongous inequality and a myriad of daily degrading and humiliating problems for almost everybody "but the highest echelons", on the level that somebody living in a Western country can't even imagine. Capitalism may have its flaws, in the US and everywhere, but man you don't know how lucky you are, compared to the alternative. And I don't wish on anybody to ever learn it. Just stay ignorant and take your knowledge from your weed-smoking cool pol-sci prof who surely knows everything about the matter. Really, this way it's much, much better.

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#324

Post by rickshab »

pabloivan57 wrote: post #304
bbrake wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving things to india sounds like a great idea, except the 13-15 hour difference in communication. it's all well and good until you're in Cupertino and taking an 11:30 pm call because they have 0 hours of overlap... guess you can force them to work US hours, but that goes to culture as well. Are they trying to show that India's workplace is more compliant and they'll just do what corp types will tell them?

I worked at Amazon for almost 10 years and I hate, repeat hate working with India teams. Their quality is subpar, period. No other way to put it

I have similar experience but with Americans. They knew very superficially about the business and completely dependent on our Indian team to get them out of their troubles. Troubles caused by again not knowing and just trusting another team (donno where they were from) to handle their issues. This isn't a one off case either. So get off your high horse. Both countries have qualified and unqualified people in tech and other fields. Just calling yourself the greatest country in the world doesn't change the fact that all of US depends on immigration

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#325

Post by ToxicMegacolon »

twojobsoneboss wrote: post #276
xcrjm wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Theoretically you have a point. On the other hand it’s so bad for recruiting. I view companies that do large layoffs the same way I view companies that do a lot of contract hiring. You clearly don’t care about employees and their wellbeing.

Be real, it’s google. They could layoff 10k every month for another year and still have people lining up from around the world to get in

Seems like direct path to becoming IBM to be honest

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#326

Post by throwaway5959 »

CydeWeys wrote: post #296
throwaway5959 wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All SWEs at Google are well compensated. Not all of them would be a good fit for maintaining Python.

Then I don't understand the point you were making in your first post.

A waste of talent not of cash.

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#327

Post by otteromkram »

rickshab wrote: post #324
pabloivan57 wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked at Amazon for almost 10 years and I hate, repeat hate working with India teams. Their quality is subpar, period. No other way to put it

I have similar experience but with Americans. They knew very superficially about the business and completely dependent on our Indian team to get them out of their troubles. Troubles caused by again not knowing and just trusting another team (donno where they were from) to handle their issues. This isn't a one off case either. So get off your high horse. Both countries have qualified and unqualified people in tech and…

I gotta agree with the parent comment about teams in india. No high horses required.

Just seemed like a bunch of Bootcamp grads not caring about work and quality. There were, of course, some competent workers there, but most seemed to have gotten hired through favoritism, not competency.

India seems to have this reputation that the entire population is made up of tech geniuses, but they have a similar ratio of idiots as anywhere else.

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#328

Post by ToxicMegacolon »

pabloivan57 wrote: post #304
bbrake wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving things to india sounds like a great idea, except the 13-15 hour difference in communication. it's all well and good until you're in Cupertino and taking an 11:30 pm call because they have 0 hours of overlap... guess you can force them to work US hours, but that goes to culture as well. Are they trying to show that India's workplace is more compliant and they'll just do what corp types will tell them?

I worked at Amazon for almost 10 years and I hate, repeat hate working with India teams. Their quality is subpar, period. No other way to put it

[flagged]

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#329

Post by otteromkram »

brutus1213 wrote: post #315
mihai_maruseac wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, production code is C++, but the way the models are built is Python code, colab, save via Orbax/TF SavedModel, etc and then serve in C++. All (most, to hedge it) development is done via Python. I don't directly develop the models, I played with some for fuzzing [1] and I'm working on security for them [2]. And, before joining GOSST, I was leading the OSS DevInfra team in TF. I still have the most number of commit…

Hello! Can I ask you for some random career advice? I am mid-career, in a low-level mgmt position but want to return to being an IC. My team's tech stack is Python and Kotlin, but in my position I don't get to code. I code for fun at home but it gravitates towards Python (as it is highly relevant for doing Deep Learning work). My question is if I ever go into a backend role, what language best lets me get into a deep…

VBA.

Good luck!

Re: Google lays off its Python team

#330

Post by ToxicMegacolon »

twojobsoneboss wrote: post #275
bbrake wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving things to india sounds like a great idea, except the 13-15 hour difference in communication. it's all well and good until you're in Cupertino and taking an 11:30 pm call because they have 0 hours of overlap... guess you can force them to work US hours, but that goes to culture as well. Are they trying to show that India's workplace is more compliant and they'll just do what corp types will tell them?

In this tech job environment the US google employee is willing to do as many 11:30 nights as needed to keep his high paying tech job, and management knows it

Management is dumb if they think that. You can't announce year long continuous layoffs, and expect people to work hard. What will the hard working employees get in return if they get laid off? Most US Google Employees are smart people, they should know that now is the time to prepare to get off that tech island, and quiet quitting is the way.
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